Raspofabs
Former 22Cans staff
Posts: 227
I like: coding, high peat single malts, ... , yeah, that's about it.
I don't like: object oriented design, and liver.
Steam: raspofabs
|
Post by Raspofabs on Oct 28, 2014 15:01:51 GMT
With weyworld being a thing, and hubworld being announced even if not released, what other worlds have people envisaged? I have gone through the suggestions but can't find any references to alternative world types apart from the obvious stuff like "ice world" or other biome based environmental dis/advantages.
Worlds provide an opportunity for rules changes. What kind of rules changes would you look for that still fit within the mechanics of the game? (or even not fit, but would be awesome)
A couple of example ideas from me:
The event map is meant to be a different scale than the normal map, and I think if we could get the followers to be little gangs instead of individual followers, then we could do that scale switch as a thing, and try some 10x gameplay. Everything suddenly becomes just a little more epic.
No-influence land. Followers can do their thing, but you cannot sculpt at all, instead the followers have learned to terraform for you. All you can do is make suggestions through the power of rain or some other temporary passive god power. No more flattening out the land, followers can't do that, too much effort.
|
|
|
Post by 13thGeneral on Oct 28, 2014 15:19:33 GMT
Cool take on some ideas there. Those both contain some aspects of what I expected Godus to actually entail. As your influence expands, and the followers spread out, so does the zoom scope of your vision. And I always expected more of an "influence" based system than what we currently have - and some challenges would be trying to win them over. So much potential, so little done with it.
As for alternate worlds that change gameplay, maybe an upside-down/reverse world, or under-water world (mer-people). No idea how the first one would he done exactly (my head is too filled with electical flowcharts at the moment), but the second could be cool. Reverse world would maybe mean that the Followers have godly powers, while all you can do is build structures. lol. Underwater world would require new resources and structures, but also the AI, pathing, and physics would need adjusting.
|
|
|
Post by Crumpy Six on Oct 28, 2014 16:38:09 GMT
- Zombies map, where instead of tribes like the Astari our followers occasionally get attacked by a zombie horde. Challenges: followers need to learn to defend themselves. Construction is challenging because you could build stronger buildings (longer and takes more resources) or weaker normal buildings (cheaper but vulnerable). Ultimate mission of the world could be seeking out and destroying/capturing the mysterious relic that creates zombies. This could result in either a bonanza of stickers (lame but in keeping with the game) or some amazing monument to can place in your homeworld for various buff effects. I am the zombie queen so in my opinion nearly everything can be improved with zombies.
- I like 13thgeneral's idea of an upside-down world too!
- Crystal land. The land is made of crystal and crunches/shatters when you sculpt. Followers have to use the oceans for food and build abodes out of fragments of crystal, but in Crystal land they can extract some awesome rare crystalline substance which provides scientific advances in homeworld. Crystal land is inhabited by walrus-like monsters that provide food and some high-value ambergris-type substance which can be used to make luxury products. If a group of followers successfully kill a crystal walrus, their family members become more wealthy (are we going to get any concept of social classes? this would be cool).
- Eternal darkness land. Either underground or at some location on the planet where there is literally never sunlight. Extremely tough to survive, followers must rely on the bizarre fungi and otherworldly creatures that live in perpetual darkness for sustenance. Progressing through Dark land requires your followers to create light sources (fires/beacons/well-lit buildings) to reveal the landscape, so it's impossible to make any grand plans for the expansion of your settlement. There is a real sense of exploration and mystery. There is plenty of coal around for followers to burn for fuel but building materials are limited to rocks and clay. This would be a good land to hide easter eggs in, but could also contain some kind of archaeological discovery for followers which they could then take back to homeworld to advance culture and science.
- Either of the above with zombies.
Edit: just noticed, having not read the OP properly, that we're trying to think of worlds other than environment biomes. Back to the drawing board!
|
|
|
Post by Gmr Leon on Oct 28, 2014 16:43:02 GMT
Love the idea of basically stacking followers into pieces like in other 4x titles in the event map, that could be interesting, especially if you could unleash god powers on that scale. It'd bring a whole new meaning to burning the game board. =P
I think a bizarre idea that would probably infuriate people would be making a world where the ground occasionally switches to "lava" like in the children's game, forcing you to frantically shake trees to draw your followers' attention and save them. However, when it's not lava, your followers try to break the rules by creating treehouses, so you have to smash them out, but all while balancing out not deforesting too much, else you won't be able to save them when you "decide" the ground's lava again.
Even worse, planting trees to try to save them makes them more inclined to try to build a treehouse in it, so you have to be especially careful with using that ability. You might make it so that all objects slightly above the ground could serve as safe spots, but as the game goes on, some of them get worse and worse. E.g.
Rocks, initially alright. -few lava rounds- Rocks, useless, now trees are alright. -few lava rounds- Trees are crap, uuh...Abodes! -few lava rounds- Bigger abodes are needed! -few lava rounds- Okay, okay settlements! -You kept all your people alive, congrats!-
Another trick might be to tweak wheat/ore to sometimes change functionality. Wheat used to construct suddenly changes to overfill buildings, forcing you to rapidly expand else they start losing happiness/dying, and ore used to construct beacons is sometimes "explosive" distorting and reshaping the land to disorient you.
Surrounding an enemy with abodes and creating a settlement suddenly smashes and crushes them by the flying abodes in the process, as well as sometimes incurring friendly fire.
Forest fires are used as a fuse to set off shrines/beacons/whatever that does something or other to enemies (think that one event where you guide followers to repair a shrine to cast down meteors on enemies, but with forest fires).
Rocks are inexplicably electrified, and if you use Rain of Purity around them, they zap adjacent structures and followers. If you drag the rain from the boulder across a chain of structures, you create chain lightning.
Gifts all become suicide spots as followers become entranced and party too hard, too long, leading to an abundance of gems/other resources but a hard decision between happiness and wealth or happiness and a populous populace.
Holy forests slowly overgrow surrounding structures making ent people because why not.
Miners converted by Astari outparty them, slowly deteriorating their happiness.
Followers refuse to build abodes, instead populating the world around shores and trees. You have to decide how to reshape the world to ensure a good mix of both, otherwise your followers will just all die out. Let's call this hippie mode.
Inside-out world. Instead of guiding followers to higher and higher land, you bring them closer and closer to water, but not just shallow water, deep trenches in the ocean. The deeper the nearby trench, the more belief/happier they are, the higher up they are, less so. Major win if you reveal a terrifying sea avatar of your being. Adding the possibility of ocean draining to bring them deeper and deeper into the seabed would be even better.
|
|
|
Post by 13thGeneral on Oct 28, 2014 18:09:38 GMT
I don't really know enough about, or have taken time to properly digest, the actual mechanics and system rulesnto suggest ways to warp or change them in interesting or unusual ways - outside of either general UI functions or physical/visual alterations.
|
|
|
Post by Danjal on Oct 28, 2014 18:27:48 GMT
I've seen suggestions for "conquest" style worlds, or atleast a conquest style gameplay. Specifically build around finding new islands or lands and "conquering" the local hazards - be they nature, man or supernatural in nature.
Similarly, the concept of "resource worlds" has come past, where you could get a specific world or island that would serve as the source of new and unique resources that would then function to "boost" the mainland. Offering new techniques and options.
There's indeed the obvious, biome challenged worlds. (Weyworld would currently fall under that catagory with the desert focus.) However, whatever route is chosen - the key would be to focus on entertaining gameplay. Don't use it as a cheap bandaid to prevent unwanted behaviour.
|
|
Lord Ba'al
Supreme Deity
Posts: 6,260
Pledge level: Half a Partner
I like: Cats; single malt Scotch; Stargate; Amiga; fried potatoes; retro gaming; cheese; snickers; sticky tape.
I don't like: Dimples in the bottom of scotch bottles; Facebook games masquerading as godgames.
Steam: stonelesscutter
GOG: stonelesscutter
|
Post by Lord Ba'al on Oct 28, 2014 18:27:51 GMT
I had envisaged one Jupiter-sized world. But I don't want to get old cows out of the ditch to put it in perfect Dinglish.
|
|
|
Post by Gmr Leon on Oct 28, 2014 18:58:33 GMT
I've seen suggestions for "conquest" style worlds, or atleast a conquest style gameplay. Specifically build around finding new islands or lands and "conquering" the local hazards - be they nature, man or supernatural in nature. Similarly, the concept of "resource worlds" has come past, where you could get a specific world or island that would serve as the source of new and unique resources that would then function to "boost" the mainland. Offering new techniques and options. There's indeed the obvious, biome challenged worlds. (Weyworld would currently fall under that catagory with the desert focus.) However, whatever route is chosen - the key would be to focus on entertaining gameplay. Don't use it as a cheap bandaid to prevent unwanted behaviour. So what you're saying is smaller verdant/rugged/hallowed lands with LOTS of granite and swiss cheese style ground that requires lots of sculpting with very few rocks around and still buggy voyages in place? Oh, and to pour some salt in the wound, valleys with beacons every step of the way? =P You know, we like to criticize them, but if they were really as malevolent or malicious as some of us may think, they could certainly make the game much worse.
|
|
|
Post by Danjal on Oct 28, 2014 19:04:05 GMT
I've seen suggestions for "conquest" style worlds, or atleast a conquest style gameplay. Specifically build around finding new islands or lands and "conquering" the local hazards - be they nature, man or supernatural in nature. Similarly, the concept of "resource worlds" has come past, where you could get a specific world or island that would serve as the source of new and unique resources that would then function to "boost" the mainland. Offering new techniques and options. There's indeed the obvious, biome challenged worlds. (Weyworld would currently fall under that catagory with the desert focus.) However, whatever route is chosen - the key would be to focus on entertaining gameplay. Don't use it as a cheap bandaid to prevent unwanted behaviour. So what you're saying is smaller verdant/rugged/hallowed lands with LOTS of granite and swiss cheese style ground that requires lots of sculpting with very few rocks around and still buggy voyages in place? Oh, and to pour some salt in the wound, valleys with beacons every step of the way? =P You know, we like to criticize them, but if they were really as malevolent or malicious as some of us may think, they could certainly make the game much worse. That depends on the intent - do you purposefully want to create a bad game, or do you focus on creating a game with as many micro-transaction focused elements as possible. Paywalls, tollbooths and other freemium elements aren't that hard to spot when it comes to Godus. And half of the other elements were introduced after Peter 'complained' that we were playing the game wrong. Now, correct me if I'm wrong - but if *we* play the game wrong, then didn't they create the game wrong? Clearly we don't find their way of play appealing? Is that our fault? Or did they simply create a game thats not fun for us? It all depends on your perspective. The way something is done can make the difference between Farmville, Simcity and Banished.
|
|
|
Post by morsealworth on Oct 28, 2014 19:11:03 GMT
Talking about worlds and the micro/macro combination. The best implementation of such in fiction I ever found wasn't in games. It was in Dune. The Empire is based on three pillars: - Military force of Sardaukar
- CHOAM
- Spacing Guild
And all three pillars are heavily dependant one one precious substance: Spice melange.
Without Spice, Sardaukars cannot practice their military arts and their bashars can't utilise their minds to the max, commanding troops most efficiently. In CHOM, Spice brings about 30% of whole GGP (Gross galactical product, as GDP would be an inaccurate term). And Spacing Guild would simply die out and leave the stars without any chance to communicate, as Spice is highly addictive and denial results in death of any Navigator.
Spice is as limited as it's precious - it cannot be produced, only mined. The only planet it is encountered on - Arrakis - is an unforgiving desert where creators of Spice hog all the water deep underground and you can't survive without a stillsuit. Even the harvester size of a football stadium isn't safe, either, as Shai-Hulud, the giant worm (and also the adult form of the sandtrout, the Spice creator) can swallow it by mistake, confused by the rhytmical sound it produces. On such high risk-high gain planet, the only rule persists: Spice must flow. Spice isn't a luxury, though it is the most expensive substance in the known universe. The world order relies on spice. If supply of spice stops, the world stops. Thousands of planets will cease to trade and will become unable to sustain the population. The survivors will be engulfed in chaos. To keep the world going. To protect the world from utter devastation and chaos. Spice must flow. This is the kind of connection between macro and micro I want to see - where the each micro map is drastically different and where macro cannot be replaced by big-scale micro, as it's often done in RTS like Warcraft.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 28, 2014 19:22:41 GMT
Could be nice to see different environment such as Sand planete, Tropical forest planete, Snow planete with the critters going with it.
Getting inspirations from Starcraft maps, or as we've already seen some Lemmings quests(voyages), get some Worms sort of similar Gameplay, except you replace of course worms by a couple of followers with weapons.
At last, (already seen kind of gameplay) making levels at the first person Minecraft's style, or Farcry's one.
|
|
|
Post by 13thGeneral on Oct 29, 2014 13:18:01 GMT
One word; Candyland!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2014 16:18:43 GMT
Anything 22cans can effectively monetise with a minimum of effort.
/reskin? /rebalance? /reanimate? /recolour?
/copy-pasta scenarios from civ games? /copy-pasta scenarios from real god games?
not sure why this just came to mind...
|
|
|
Post by Deth on Oct 29, 2014 16:35:39 GMT
Some good(ish) ideas here. But I for one would not want other re-skinned worlds. I wanted the one big world the promised looking the way they have it. But that is just me. Raspofabs I know this is a thought exercise(so do not take this the wrong way please.) but I would prefer what is broken and deliver more of what is promised.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2014 20:10:03 GMT
Some good(ish) ideas here. But I for one would not want other re-skinned worlds. I wanted the one big world the promised looking the way they have it. But that is just me. Raspofabs I know this is a thought exercise(so do not take this the wrong way please.) but I would prefer what is broken and deliver more of what is promised. I agree Deth, however, let me venture a wild guess here: The current worlds islands are as big as their tech/hardware limitations will allow, necessitating separately existing worlds islands. Heaven DeNA forbid the mobile users experience anything less than buttery-smooth gameplay monetesation mechanics on their iPotato 4s.
|
|
|
Post by Gmr Leon on Oct 29, 2014 20:18:58 GMT
Some good(ish) ideas here. But I for one would not want other re-skinned worlds. I wanted the one big world the promised looking the way they have it. But that is just me. Raspofabs I know this is a thought exercise(so do not take this the wrong way please.) but I would prefer what is broken and deliver more of what is promised. I'm betting you meant you wouldn't prefer what's broken, in which case I mostly agree. I'd be okay with larger islands in an overworld setup though, personally, if a compromise must be made. However if we could see something more like Sins of a Solar Empire, being able to zoom into the islands and out to archipelagos/continents, that'd be awesome too.
|
|
|
Post by Deth on Oct 30, 2014 5:09:23 GMT
Some good(ish) ideas here. But I for one would not want other re-skinned worlds. I wanted the one big world the promised looking the way they have it. But that is just me. Raspofabs I know this is a thought exercise(so do not take this the wrong way please.) but I would prefer what is broken and deliver more of what is promised. I agree Deth, however, let me venture a wild guess here: The current worlds islands are as big as their tech/hardware limitations will allow, necessitating separately existing worlds islands. Heaven DeNA forbid the mobile users experience anything less than buttery-smooth gameplay monetesation mechanics on their iPotato 4s. Yea I know and that sadly my me not even want to bother with posting more ideas as it just gets my hopes up and I know they are just going to get dashed. Here I was laying in bed and could not sleep and had some thoughs on a diffrent way of doing this. I come to make a more positive post, I read things and just realize my ideas will not work or even be used in any way and my positive post goes the other way. I guess for postarity I should post my Idea. Instead of a new world type I though what if we could change the world to the type we want. I would not want to conform to a world but conform the world to me. I would not want a world that changes back and forth between lava and normal land, I already did this in StarCraft 2 and hated it with a precise pointer and RTS controls. Now if it was a world of lava that I could change lava to useable land through some mechanic beyond just scuplting. Maybe you need to do something to earn a type of belief. Used in the current thought of needing new worlds I could see the convert land from one type to another to grow the world could be used just play with the mechanic to get the correct belief type needed. Thinking about it it might be interesting try to figure out what you need to do to generate the correct type of belief for the current world. While laying in bed I also thought about how we are looking at god games, or at least Godus. I think we are looking at it in terms of big G one God vs small g God(s). For the same reason as there has never been a great Superman game because as a sole super powerful being there is no challenge. I think Godus is being looked at as you being the big G leading people from the beginning of time and focus on the followers. What if a step was taken back and focus was moved from the followers so instead of us all being the one big G god we all became small g gods and goddess and the cards were not about what the followers learn but about what we as gods/goddess learn and each power/sphere of control we gain has a follow power/skill/object or set of powers/skill/objects. But again that would have to be a new different game and maybe some day we will have a Godus 2 more like that. Sorry for the rambling as it is late and derailing the thread even father and I could not sleep. Now back to your regularly scheduled new world ideas.
|
|
|
Post by engarde on Oct 30, 2014 8:55:55 GMT
I like the notion of a 'roulette' wheel which spins and temporarily joins worlds, maybe akin to that Star Trek episode where they take a leap and jump through - with that jump through either being a temporary join point between Godus play A and player B - or opens up a pair of different bits of land in smaller world - lets say C- which depending on who wins permanently links to that winning homeworld.
|
|
Raspofabs
Former 22Cans staff
Posts: 227
I like: coding, high peat single malts, ... , yeah, that's about it.
I don't like: object oriented design, and liver.
Steam: raspofabs
|
Post by Raspofabs on Oct 31, 2014 14:46:03 GMT
- Crystal land. The land is made of crystal and crunches/shatters when you sculpt. Followers have to use the oceans for food and build abodes out of fragments of crystal, but in Crystal land they can extract some awesome rare crystalline substance which provides scientific advances in homeworld. Crystal land is inhabited by walrus-like monsters that provide food and some high-value ambergris-type substance which can be used to make luxury products. If a group of followers successfully kill a crystal walrus, their family members become more wealthy (are we going to get any concept of social classes? this would be cool). I like this one, but how about because the crystal shattered, it's impossible to do any "positive" sculpting? So, this would mean you cannot pull land out, only destroy it. You might have to use rain of purity or something to annoyingly expensive to slowly regrow the crystal land where you accidentally damaged it.
|
|
|
Post by Gmr Leon on Oct 31, 2014 15:53:53 GMT
- Crystal land. The land is made of crystal and crunches/shatters when you sculpt. Followers have to use the oceans for food and build abodes out of fragments of crystal, but in Crystal land they can extract some awesome rare crystalline substance which provides scientific advances in homeworld. Crystal land is inhabited by walrus-like monsters that provide food and some high-value ambergris-type substance which can be used to make luxury products. If a group of followers successfully kill a crystal walrus, their family members become more wealthy (are we going to get any concept of social classes? this would be cool). I like this one, but how about because the crystal shattered, it's impossible to do any "positive" sculpting? So, this would mean you cannot pull land out, only destroy it. You might have to use rain of purity or something to annoyingly expensive to slowly regrow the crystal land where you accidentally damaged it. Wouldn't this be a perfect opportunity to instead implement a column/pillar of fire ability to fuse the crystals back together?
|
|