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Post by militairensneuvelen on Jan 15, 2015 8:12:32 GMT
I would recommend to stop using it.
It makes me feel like you are really rushing things.
Urgency is of some kind of essence, I realize that (work began in 2012, it's 2015)
But don't make people feel like they are going to get some afterthought.
I'm trying to stop posting on Steam, but I keep seeing that word "sprint" (usually followed by massively disappointed people).
I know it's only a word used in the IT business, but customers might not be aware of that.
They think they will get something FAST. (hence the feeling of "rushed" "slapped on" additions to the game when they are still very much a concept)
€0.02
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Post by engarde on Jan 15, 2015 9:35:04 GMT
I've yet to be convinced their usage is anything like a sprint, the intended target is to have deliverable content very regularly - not exactly what we see in either PC or mobile.
If we pretend they are actually using an agile methodology, we as customers (or our representatives) are supposed to be involved and our lack of understanding of the terms and concepts is down to their scrum master or whatever flavour they are using, it has never been clear to me who our reps in that instance were supposed to be nor how they keeping us informed but....
I'd be more annoyed by their use of terms like game, god game, re-imagining...
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Post by earlparvisjam on Jan 15, 2015 14:22:21 GMT
Sprint is a term that comes from Agile Development. It's not something they made up but a semi-standardized term that's supposed to mean something. Of course, their actual usage of it has been a bit questionable since it has, at times, only vaguely resembled actual sprints.
The problem isn't in the use of the term but in the application of the process. At best, they technically qualify as agile. At worst, they are just using the terms as an empty means of describing how their work is broken down. A good example of this sort of thing is the way they've used "Iterative Design" as if it's something special in software development. Hint: All software development is iterative.
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Post by FuriousMoo on Jan 15, 2015 17:43:59 GMT
Blame production, I'm half convinced they make up all this stuff up on the spot to make us think they are working really hard. Yesterday someone suggested a 'task carpark'....uh huh........
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Post by Crumpy Six on Jan 15, 2015 20:34:08 GMT
LOL... no offense but 'task carpark' sounds like a pretty accurate description of 22Cans, from a community perspective.
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Post by hardly on Jan 15, 2015 21:47:19 GMT
Blame production, I'm half convinced they make up all this stuff up on the spot to make us think they are working really hard. Yesterday someone suggested a 'task carpark'....uh huh........ Your industry is not alone in the distortion and misuse of language to confuse. |
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Post by engarde on Jan 16, 2015 14:45:03 GMT
Lets start with what exactly 'Production' is in that statement...
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Post by 13thGeneral on Jan 16, 2015 15:22:40 GMT
Blame production, I'm half convinced they make up all this stuff up on the spot to make us think they are working really hard. Yesterday someone suggested a 'task carpark'....uh huh........ Well it doesn't surprise me... I've heard some suspiciously made up terms working in both marketing and government. Seems to always be certain job types. So, exactly what does "Production" do, supposedly, in game design; what is the general purpose? I have some idea, having worked as a graphic designer, but just curious how it differs... and how 22cans defines it compared to the "industry norm". |
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Post by FuriousMoo on Jan 16, 2015 15:48:32 GMT
Production is nothing to do with game design. Basically software development is split into five broad fields. Code, Art, Production, Design and QA. The bigger the studio the more specialisations within these fields.
In terms of the creation of a game, production is essentially the glue that brings all these fields together. They schedule and track tasks, assign resources. procure resources (if I wanted to say source art assets from outside the company they would organise it). Everything from project management to marketing and pr.
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Post by 13thGeneral on Jan 16, 2015 16:16:24 GMT
Production is nothing to do with game design. Basically software development is split into five broad fields. Code, Art, Production, Design and QA. The bigger the studio the more specialisations within these fields. In terms of the creation of a game, production is essentially the glue that brings all these fields together. They schedule and track tasks, assign resources. procure resources (if I wanted to say source art assets from outside the company they would organise it). Everything from project management to marketing and pr. Thanks. Basically what I thought it was. I'll keep my opinions and observations about that area of business - and some of the personality types within it (though, obviously not everyone) - but suffice to say, I have a fair idea how it all "functions". Aaaanyway... semantics and office politicos aside, how're things shaping up for next week? Have we provided you with any useful feedback and/or suggestions? |
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Post by FuriousMoo on Jan 16, 2015 17:02:24 GMT
Dave should be announcing the next sprint any time now. I've been mostly in planning and design bubble, while everyone else has been working of finishing the Asia launch which thankfully is now pretty much done. Monday we start work on a new feature. Details on the feature will be somewhat candid, the reason for which will be rather obvious (I'm going to let Dave announce it), but I will be trying to get some community involvement in some form.
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Post by FuriousMoo on Jan 16, 2015 17:05:06 GMT
Nope I've just been corrected. Dave is going to announce on Monday.
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Post by Spiderweb on Jan 16, 2015 18:53:34 GMT
Dave should be announcing the next sprint any time now. I've been mostly in planning and design bubble, while everyone else has been working of finishing the Asia launch which thankfully is now pretty much done. Monday we start work on a new feature. Details on the feature will be somewhat candid, the reason for which will be rather obvious (I'm going to let Dave announce it), but I will be trying to get some community involvement in some form. I wish he'd announced today, steam forums are very agitated with lack of comms. (Me being one of them). i really hope you pull it out of the bag in this next sprint. I really want to feel positive about Godus again but finding it very hard with no comms and no sign of builds (I do appreciated you involvement on this forum). Hopefully what Dave puts out will help. |
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Post by FuriousMoo on Jan 17, 2015 0:36:47 GMT
I'd keep your expectations in check for now. It's going to be a fairly modest feature. Small steps to start with. There also a big round of bug fixing happening so I had to pick something that didn't involve large amounts of coding.
It's been a pretty tense week, a lot of pressure on me to forget the pc focus and concentrate on increasing mobile monetisation. Pressure from people I can't ignore. It's understandable, this is a business and there's no way the pc version will make nearly as much money as mobile. I had no way to defend pc focus from a business standpoint. Say what you like about Peter, but he was really supportive and intervened. Can't say where this change of heart has come from, but feeling pretty good to have him on my side. I don't know where this change of heart has come from, but it seems he's pretty adamant about sorting out Godus pc. I think it's still going to be a battle to get the resources I want, but feeling much better about the whole thing now.
I also pitched the idea of ripping out gems from pc completely to Peter today too. He was wary, but I think he'll go for it. Just to put this into perspective, 6 months ago anyone who even suggested calling gems on pc by another name was shot down instantly. It was just not up for discussion AT ALL.
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Post by hardly on Jan 17, 2015 0:40:58 GMT
I'd keep your expectations in check for now. It's going to be a fairly modest feature. Small steps to start with. There also a big round of bug fixing happening so I had to pick something that didn't involve large amounts of coding. It's been a pretty tense week, a lot of pressure on me to forget the pc focus and concentrate on increasing mobile monetisation. Pressure from people I can't ignore. It's understandable, this is a business and there's no way the pc version will make nearly as much money as mobile. I had no way to defend pc focus from a business standpoint. Say what you like about Peter, but he was really supportive and intervened. Can't say where this change of heart has come from, but feeling pretty good to have him on my side. I don't know where this change of heart has come from, but it seems he's pretty adamant about sorting out Godus pc. I think it's still going to be a battle to get the resources I want, but feeling much better about the whole thing now. I also pitched the idea of ripping out gems from pc completely to Peter today too. He was wary, but I think he'll go for it. Just to put this into perspective, 6 months ago anyone who even suggested calling gems on pc by another name was shot down instantly. It was just not up for discussion AT ALL. So pressure from people you can't ignore who aren't Peter. This makes me wonder who those people are? I'm assuming it's not Jack lol. So there are obviously some influential people in 22cans who we don't know. |
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Post by Qetesh on Jan 17, 2015 0:47:50 GMT
I'd keep your expectations in check for now. It's going to be a fairly modest feature. Small steps to start with. There also a big round of bug fixing happening so I had to pick something that didn't involve large amounts of coding. It's been a pretty tense week, a lot of pressure on me to forget the pc focus and concentrate on increasing mobile monetisation. Pressure from people I can't ignore. It's understandable, this is a business and there's no way the pc version will make nearly as much money as mobile. I had no way to defend pc focus from a business standpoint. Say what you like about Peter, but he was really supportive and intervened. Can't say where this change of heart has come from, but feeling pretty good to have him on my side. I don't know where this change of heart has come from, but it seems he's pretty adamant about sorting out Godus pc. I think it's still going to be a battle to get the resources I want, but feeling much better about the whole thing now. I also pitched the idea of ripping out gems from pc completely to Peter today too. He was wary, but I think he'll go for it. Just to put this into perspective, 6 months ago anyone who even suggested calling gems on pc by another name was shot down instantly. It was just not up for discussion AT ALL. Does he get that he got backed by promising a PC game and how insanely vile it is too think his backers should not be provided what he promised and we are not now, nor have we ever bought the spin about mobile coming first? Does he understand how bad it makes KS look by doing this? We gave him a ton over the original goal too so why does he think it is okay for us not to come first? There would be no Godus without us. Period. If he says that is not true, then he never should have taken our money and should refund all backers unhappy with the Godus path. All I can say is.....lawsuit, he is not clear of that option by a long shot. Give me my money back and all is forgiven PM. |
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Post by rubgish on Jan 17, 2015 0:48:02 GMT
Anyone who is financially invested in 22cans, which we don't know because it's not a publicly owned company.
It's entirely to be expected that they are pushing for maximal money, but it's far more interesting to hear that Peter was still adamant about gems 6 months ago. It kinda says a lot considering how consistently & uniformly the entire PC community has been against them since they were first implemented.
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Post by Qetesh on Jan 17, 2015 0:51:59 GMT
Anyone who is financially invested in 22cans, which we don't know because it's not a publicly owned company. It's entirely to be expected that they are pushing for maximal money, but it's far more interesting to hear that Peter was still adamant about gems 6 months ago. It kinda says a lot considering how consistently & uniformly the entire PC community has been against them since they were first implemented. I said this since first Alpha, Mobile F2p was planned all along, at the very least since DeNa. Peter sold his soul, a long time ago. |
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Post by Spiderweb on Jan 17, 2015 0:53:52 GMT
So pressure from people you can't ignore who aren't Peter. This makes me wonder who those people are? I'm assuming it's not Jack lol. So there are obviously some influential people in 22cans who we don't know. My guess is the finance dept quite simply, they need the money coming in to keep the power on and the people getting paid. |
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Post by Spiderweb on Jan 17, 2015 0:56:15 GMT
I'd keep your expectations in check for now. It's going to be a fairly modest feature. Small steps to start with. There also a big round of bug fixing happening so I had to pick something that didn't involve large amounts of coding. It's been a pretty tense week, a lot of pressure on me to forget the pc focus and concentrate on increasing mobile monetisation. Pressure from people I can't ignore. It's understandable, this is a business and there's no way the pc version will make nearly as much money as mobile. I had no way to defend pc focus from a business standpoint. Say what you like about Peter, but he was really supportive and intervened. Can't say where this change of heart has come from, but feeling pretty good to have him on my side. I don't know where this change of heart has come from, but it seems he's pretty adamant about sorting out Godus pc. I think it's still going to be a battle to get the resources I want, but feeling much better about the whole thing now. I also pitched the idea of ripping out gems from pc completely to Peter today too. He was wary, but I think he'll go for it. Just to put this into perspective, 6 months ago anyone who even suggested calling gems on pc by another name was shot down instantly. It was just not up for discussion AT ALL. Change of heart? He only needs to read the disappointment on the forums and the damage to his reputation he has been causing. But I'm glad he is with you and listening. |
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