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Post by idem on Feb 9, 2016 19:12:32 GMT
1 cherry is a micro-transaction  |
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Mandrake
Master
The Vault Boogeyman
Posts: 113 
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Post by Mandrake on Feb 9, 2016 19:40:58 GMT
Very true. They just need to sit down admit they fucked up. That they are going to start from scratch, weather the storm, and try to build the game they promised. If they could do that and hold the coarse, I think they could earn the trust back from a lot of people. Just be honest with what they can and can not do and lay down a road map. That would have been the sensible thing*, what Peter and 22cans all said that they were going to do because of "The Shit" and whatnot, and yet we find that it has been something of a different story all this time. Even Peter, in his "I'm not going to talk to the press" bit IIRC, said that we should expect the Godus that was backed in a few months. *looks at the state of Godus Wars* *sighs and shrugs* Whatever. I'm just waiting for Peter's explanation for why he's only had a small bit of his studio working on Godus Wars in response to The Shit, how he seemed to only begrudgingly have returned any significant part of the studio to working on this big deal and big promises, and... how much have they been spending upon The Trail's development? I wonder what kind of industry discourse would be opened up if a journalist mentioned that in an article. Especially if all of those who had bought/backed Godus/Godus Wars asked about certain bits "Why wasn't that put into Godus?" There's bad management and throwing in the towel, which is what Spacebase DF-9 represents; compared to that, Godus has rightfully earned its own place as a far worse pejorative. * - That way your past problems simply become part of the past instead of being a backdrop for your current problems. |
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Mandrake
Master
The Vault Boogeyman
Posts: 113
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Post by Mandrake on Feb 9, 2016 19:46:48 GMT
Peter admits all the time he fucks up. And he even admits he'll prolly keep doing it. Hasn't made much difference. Though, come to think of it, what makes him 'that guy who betrays everyone' instead of 'that guy whom we all know to take with a huge grain of salt'? I mean, didn't we all know from the start that he says stuff that ends up not happening a lot? I reckon most of us knew his career before getting his latest game. So we knew he over promises. We knew that what we were going to end up with wasn't going to be the same same as what comes out of his mouth. So why are so many of us surprised? Or even feel betrayed. We knew, right? I think what made the difference was where Peter crossed the line from "overpromising" clear into "scam artist". That was where the Faithful became the Betrayed, or rather, the Astari. |
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Post by idem on Feb 9, 2016 19:48:38 GMT
What, he did it on purpose?
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Mandrake
Master
The Vault Boogeyman
Posts: 113
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Post by Mandrake on Feb 9, 2016 20:00:03 GMT
What, he did it on purpose? There's no other explanation, especially since he had most of the studio working on The Trail instead of actually working upon Godus outside of a path towards more microtransaction baiting, through another pass of the "paying to test" public of Early Access (as 22cans have treated EA so far). Just not with as abusive of a microtransaction model as in "vanilla Godus". The only Kickstarter reward 22cans seems to remember lately is the art book, which took all of last year to remember, make, and celebrate. I can't recall them making mention of anything else in all of that time. |
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Post by idem on Feb 9, 2016 20:13:21 GMT
That's not what I was thinking, but I see what you mean. I chucked it up to him failing to make Godus good, and giving it to someone else who might do better than he did. Then he could try his hand at something else instead. He told everyone it was going to be this awesome thing, and at some point he figured out he couldn't live up to it, so he passed the buck. That's failure, and it's cowardly. But scamming, idk.
He never needed malice to disastrously overpromise before. He's always done shit like that.
Plus, before he left Microsoft, he was making a good amount of money. What does he need a scam for?
You might be right though, but I think stupidity already explains what happens enough for me.
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Mandrake
Master
The Vault Boogeyman
Posts: 113
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Post by Mandrake on Feb 9, 2016 22:16:21 GMT
That's not what I was thinking, but I see what you mean. I chucked it up to him failing to make Godus good, and giving it to someone else who might do better than he did. Then he could try his hand at something else instead. He told everyone it was going to be this awesome thing, and at some point he figured out he couldn't live up to it, so he passed the buck. That's failure, and it's cowardly. But scamming, idk. Considering that there hasn't been anything close to a design document outside of the roadmap, which wasn't used except for a time as evidence that 22cans had plans for anything, there weren't plans behind Godus after "Get the money." 22cans have been spending three years trying to figure out where to go with Godus and still look like they're unsure of what they're doing. Literally spending on labour costs, including on what appears to be a surplus of employees in all the wrong places. It is one thing to overpromise, another to intentionally take money for a product you really don't intend to make nor have made any honest effort towards doing so. The production of Godus really has shown that...rather, the production on The Trail has shown that PM has effectively moved on after years of dancing around until most gave up him delivering even the basics of the game he pitched. Then he dances again for Godus Wars. Curious. PM already sunk a fair bit of his own money into the studio. An over-produced cow clicker of Curiosity, that could have been made by a studio nowhere near the size of 22cans, couldn't have have pulled in that much - the net worth of 22cans appears to have been in decline since the beginning. Then having tons of people with little output upon Godus as it repeats a similar production? Then while trying to hide from Godus, spending a fair bit more on The Trail in those same costs? If PM wasn't hurting for money then Godus' design/production wouldn't have been such a mess to acquire money at the expense of all involved. It looks like 22cans was set up to be a "good ole boy club" of some folks making money off of industry reputation and work on the cheap from hiring new folks, with just enough experienced to know how to keep things at least running. At this point, most of the experienced have run screaming from 22cans, while many others have set up their own ventures. I don't think it was stupidity or idealism this time around, but rather trying to cash in on a reputation and having it backfire because the effort was completely not honest - except for some who signed on thinking they were going to be making something other than a mobile clone-a-thon, like Fabs originally joined 22cans to do truly innovative work. Only to have PM first trash Dungeon Keeper Mobile's microtransaction system to come up with worse. This latest bit with Godus Wars seems to be designed to benefit from the whole controversy some more. 22cans' problems don't originate from stupidity, their problem is from evil. |
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sjoerd93
Wannabe
Posts: 20
Pledge level: Patron
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Post by sjoerd93 on Feb 10, 2016 17:01:39 GMT
Let's dispel once and for all with this fiction that 22Cans doesn't know what they're doing. They know exactly what they're doing.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2016 18:16:12 GMT
Let's dispel once and for all with this fiction that 22Cans doesn't know what they're doing. They know exactly what they're doing. Agreed. I'm just surprised we didn't get a, "Godus was crap, Godus Wars will be amazing!" schpiel from Peter. Oh well, maybe we'll get one for The Trail. |
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Post by greay on Feb 10, 2016 18:41:48 GMT
Let's dispel once and for all with this fiction that 22Cans doesn't know what they're doing. They know exactly what they're doing.  |
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Post by Gmr Leon on Feb 10, 2016 18:50:32 GMT
Let's dispel once and for all with this fiction that 22Cans doesn't know what they're doing. They know exactly what they're doing. Let's dispel once and for all with this fiction that we don't know what they're doing. We know exactly what they're doing. =D |
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sjoerd93
Wannabe
Posts: 20
Pledge level: Patron
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Post by sjoerd93 on Feb 10, 2016 19:13:32 GMT
To be clear, my comment was a reference to the phrase Marco Rubio repeated four times within fifty minutes or so during the GOP debates.
The phrase is pretty much going viral, I thought it was appropriate (and perhaps accurate as well to some degree) in this context considering how Mandrake said "22cans' problems don't originate from stupidity, their problem is from evil.".
To be clear, using this does not reflect my opinion on Rubio one way or another (or for any other candidate for that matter). This is not a place to discuss politics, and I don't intend to do that here. Especially not in this thread.
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Post by idem on Feb 10, 2016 21:38:16 GMT
Mandrake Seems your mind is pretty much made up about him. (not that that's wrong, just saying)
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Post by Gmr Leon on Feb 10, 2016 21:49:23 GMT
To be clear, my comment was a reference to the phrase Marco Rubio repeated four times within fifty minutes or so during the GOP debates. Let's dispel once and for all with this fiction that we don't know what you're doing. We know exactly what you're doing. =D |
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