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Post by Gmr Leon on Dec 14, 2014 7:04:16 GMT
Hmm. I missed this one a few weeks ago. I'm very interested to hear this particular tale some day. I'd love to hear Sam's uncensored version of events but I'm not holding my breath. It would likely be very damaging for him to spills the preverbial beans. "I thought a dude I worked for could be trusted, instead he threw me and everyone we drew in under a bus alongside everything I thought we were working on. Lots of creativity squandered in the name of greed-driven 'reinvention' of a genre by integrating all the worst elements we claimed to be against."
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Raspofabs
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Post by Raspofabs on Dec 14, 2014 18:16:24 GMT
Hmm. I missed this one a few weeks ago. I'm very interested to hear this particular tale some day. I'd love to hear Sam's uncensored version of events but I'm not holding my breath. It would likely be very damaging for him to spills the preverbial beans. It doesn't appear that he holds anything back. He also has strong opinions about how the development should have played out, and they did not align with Peter's. This and his willingness to say things that are subjective as if they are fact, makes his communications difficult to read for me. I still think of him as a friend, but he is attacking me with the things he says. I wish he would at least stick to the facts.
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Post by hardly on Dec 14, 2014 18:32:57 GMT
I'd love to hear Sam's uncensored version of events but I'm not holding my breath. It would likely be very damaging for him to spills the preverbial beans. It doesn't appear that he holds anything back. He also has strong opinions about how the development should have played out, and they did not align with Peter's. This and his willingness to say things that are subjective as if they are fact, makes his communications difficult to read for me. I still think of him as a friend, but he is attacking me with the things he says. I wish he would at least stick to the facts. I think it's quite common for people within organisations to feel compromised by the difference between the organisations stated position and its actual position. As you'll be aware Ras there is a strong feeling in the community that peter and others mislead the community in order to raise funding for a mobile development he didn't fully disclose. Even in his own words he has talked about the temptation to say anything to get a kickstarter funded. I'm giving Sam the benefit of the doubt and assuming he didn't have the moral flexibility required to keep saying a duck wasn't a duck.
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Post by hardly on Dec 14, 2014 18:37:03 GMT
Just further to my above post it's probably easy for a coder like yourself to take pleasure from a job well done with regard to a minor element even if the overall product doesn't meet expectations. For Sam if his job well done is to mollify the community then perhaps you can see why he might have felt more compromised.
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heggers
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Post by heggers on Dec 14, 2014 18:40:39 GMT
Maybe this train of thought would b better served in its own topic however I do have a candid hypothetical for you Fabs. If alpha v1.0 had been available (as with all kickstarters from now it should be) do you think the funding would have been successful? Personally I don't think so.
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Raspofabs
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Post by Raspofabs on Dec 14, 2014 18:48:35 GMT
Maybe this train of thought would b better served in its own topic however I do have a candid hypothetical for you Fabs. If alpha v1.0 had been available (as with all kickstarters from now it should be) do you think the funding would have been successful? Personally I don't think so. I think we would have made the target sooner, and probably kept in that track better rather than veering off towards f2p. I think we lost out on a lot of sales because no-one knew who 22cans was. A solid demo would have helped there.
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heggers
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Post by heggers on Dec 14, 2014 19:01:11 GMT
Maybe this train of thought would b better served in its own topic however I do have a candid hypothetical for you Fabs. If alpha v1.0 had been available (as with all kickstarters from now it should be) do you think the funding would have been successful? Personally I don't think so. I think we would have made the target sooner, and probably kept in that track better rather than veering off towards f2p. I think we lost out on a lot of sales because no-one knew who 22cans was. A solid demo would have helped there. I don't know who even half the indie devs I've backed for projects are. I didn't back Godus because of 22Cans. You're a faceless entity at the end of the day like Rocksteady and other devs. I backed (stupidly) because Peter was the figurehead. If you had wanted to sell as 22Cans alone, Peter shouldn't have been everywhere, his studio or no
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Post by morsealworth on Dec 14, 2014 19:07:35 GMT
I didn't even back because of Peter, but because I was fed magic words Black & White, Dungeon Keeper, Populous. Yes, in that order.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2014 19:15:52 GMT
Maybe this train of thought would b better served in its own topic however I do have a candid hypothetical for you Fabs. If alpha v1.0 had been available (as with all kickstarters from now it should be) do you think the funding would have been successful? Personally I don't think so. I think we would have made the target sooner, and probably kept in that track better rather than veering off towards f2p. I think we lost out on a lot of sales because no-one knew who 22cans was. A solid demo would have helped there. Alpha 1, wasn't that the Version from June 2013? I think funding would have been almost impossible, with what we have seen there. Even the Kickstarter Prototype looked much more like a good god game than Alpha 1.
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Post by hardly on Dec 14, 2014 19:44:38 GMT
Maybe this train of thought would b better served in its own topic however I do have a candid hypothetical for you Fabs. If alpha v1.0 had been available (as with all kickstarters from now it should be) do you think the funding would have been successful? Personally I don't think so. I think we would have made the target sooner, and probably kept in that track better rather than veering off towards f2p. I think we lost out on a lot of sales because no-one knew who 22cans was. A solid demo would have helped there. We'll never know what a world without f2p Godus looks like, maybe it would have been a financial and creative failure, but I would still like to have seen you try and make it a success.
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Raspofabs
Former 22Cans staff
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I like: coding, high peat single malts, ... , yeah, that's about it.
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Post by Raspofabs on Dec 14, 2014 19:54:34 GMT
I think we would have made the target sooner, and probably kept in that track better rather than veering off towards f2p. I think we lost out on a lot of sales because no-one knew who 22cans was. A solid demo would have helped there. I don't know who even half the indie devs I've backed for projects are. I didn't back Godus because of 22Cans. You're a faceless entity at the end of the day like Rocksteady and other devs. I backed (stupidly) because Peter was the figurehead. If you had wanted to sell as 22Cans alone, Peter shouldn't have been everywhere, his studio or no Yourself and most of the others here are that type of backer. If we'd pitched with a game demo, this forum wouldn't be populated by people who back things without any proof that we have the team to do it. Even if everyone on here said that they wouldn't have backed of they had seen the alpha build first, that doesn't follow logically. That the game has gone a different direction, is a different matter. I was asked my opinion on whether we would have been funded. I think if we had either said "we're making this" and shown the alpha, or said "we're making something, we don't know what" and shown nothing but proof of previous work, then we would have been funded too. Basically, I think Peter promised something, stuff happened, Peter changed direction a bit, while trying to maintain as close to the original promise as possible, and has so far, made something that is not either what he wanted, or what he promised. Hopefully over the coming months, we can rectify at least what was promised.
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Post by Gmr Leon on Dec 14, 2014 20:00:44 GMT
I don't know who even half the indie devs I've backed for projects are. I didn't back Godus because of 22Cans. You're a faceless entity at the end of the day like Rocksteady and other devs. I backed (stupidly) because Peter was the figurehead. If you had wanted to sell as 22Cans alone, Peter shouldn't have been everywhere, his studio or no Yourself and most of the others here are that type of backer. If we'd pitched with a game demo, this forum wouldn't be populated by people who back things without any proof that we have the team to do it. Even if everyone on here said that they wouldn't have backed of they had seen the alpha build first, that doesn't follow logically. That the game has gone a different direction, is a different matter. I was asked my opinion on whether we would have been funded. I think if we had either said "we're making this" and shown the alpha, or said "we're making something, we don't know what" and shown nothing but proof of previous work, then we would have been funded too. Basically, I think Peter promised something, stuff happened, Peter changed direction a bit, while trying to maintain as close to the original promise as possible, and has so far, made something that is not either what he wanted, or what he promised. Hopefully over the coming months, we can rectify at least what was promised. Here's to hoping...On a lighter note, there's some cold humor in imagining that Peter disappoints himself as much as us.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 14, 2014 20:26:40 GMT
Hopefully over the coming months, we can rectify at least what was promised. I hope so too, Fabs. I hope so too, although to be perfectly honest, at this point I'm not expecting Godus to be able to make a handful of Peters more grandiose promises on much more than the tip of a technicality.
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heggers
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Post by heggers on Dec 14, 2014 21:14:52 GMT
Hopefully over the coming months, we can rectify at least what was promised. Honestly you me both. However I also subscribe to the thought that fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Sorry but I'm a depressive cynic at the end of the day. However I do think its awesome that an actual coder appears on the forums to talk to people rather than use the corporate mouthpieces Props to you sir
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Lord Ba'al
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Post by Lord Ba'al on Dec 15, 2014 6:48:19 GMT
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Post by distraction on Dec 15, 2014 10:31:30 GMT
Hmm. I missed this one a few weeks ago. I'm very interested to hear this particular tale some day. maybe 1 day he'll register here to spil the beans?
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Post by Monkeythumbz on Dec 15, 2014 11:46:26 GMT
Hmm. I missed this one a few weeks ago. I'm very interested to hear this particular tale some day. maybe 1 day he'll register here to spil the beans? I'll give him a prod.
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Lord Ba'al
Supreme Deity
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Post by Lord Ba'al on Dec 15, 2014 19:06:09 GMT
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Lord Ba'al
Supreme Deity
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I like: Cats; single malt Scotch; Stargate; Amiga; fried potatoes; retro gaming; cheese; snickers; sticky tape.
I don't like: Dimples in the bottom of scotch bottles; Facebook games masquerading as godgames.
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Post by Lord Ba'al on Dec 15, 2014 23:48:33 GMT
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Post by hardly on Dec 16, 2014 2:00:49 GMT
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