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Post by greay on Aug 19, 2014 21:39:25 GMT
1 b) Again, this is highly unlikely as we don't currently run analytics on the PC version of the game - this is why it's essential you provide your reasoning when supplying your edited balance files. I'd really like more details on this. How long has this been going on? I'll be honest, I've definitely felt that there's been an overemphasis on analytics, but given how important they seem to be (at least to PM, if not all of 22cans) I'm pretty surprised that shortly after releasing the settlements update they/re not being looked at for the PC version. Is this just because you're focusing on mobile right now? And that actually somewhat answers my question from the official forums a while back – if you're not running analytics on the PC version, there's no way you can be looking at how much time people spend with the game running, but not interacting with it (i.e. just waiting). |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 19, 2014 22:21:12 GMT
George said he would talk to Production about this and get back to us "Tomorrow ™" with some specifics.
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Post by greay on Aug 20, 2014 0:16:15 GMT
ah, cool. I don't spend much time on the Steam forums so I didn't see his responses there. I'm definitely curious to learn more.
(and honestly, I'd really like to get some concrete info on how they do use their analytics, besides)
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Post by Monkeythumbz on Aug 20, 2014 11:02:44 GMT
George said he would talk to Production about this and get back to us "Tomorrow ™" with some specifics. I'm on it. |
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Post by Monkeythumbz on Aug 20, 2014 12:05:45 GMT
Okay, this is what I have found out so far: - We do have analytics on PC, giving us the ability to see how many users are playing, when they are playing, session length etc.
- Our early experiences of analytics on PC fed into how we now do analytics on mobile.
- We have superior analytics available to us on mobile than on PC thanks to Mobage, which is not on PC.
- We will not be running analytics on the balance file modding tool as we want you to share your reasoning for making changes with us so as to provide depth and context.
[/ul] Hope that answers your questions! |
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Post by neonero on Aug 20, 2014 12:36:25 GMT
Okay, this is what I have found out so far: - We do have analytics on PC, giving us the ability to see how many users are playing, when they are playing, session length etc.
- Our early experiences of analytics on PC fed into how we now do analytics on mobile.
- We have superior analytics available to us on mobile than on PC thanks to Mobage, which is not on PC.
- We will not be running analytics on the balance file modding tool as we want you to share your reasoning for making changes with us so as to provide depth and context.
[/ul] Hope that answers your questions![/quote]Well session length seems meaningless. I often let godus run in the back round while i do other things. Like watching Stargate( damm you Ba'al^^) I even baked muffins/ cupcakes while waiting for the timers^^ |
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Post by Monkeythumbz on Aug 20, 2014 12:41:52 GMT
Okay, this is what I have found out so far: - We do have analytics on PC, giving us the ability to see how many users are playing, when they are playing, session length etc.
- Our early experiences of analytics on PC fed into how we now do analytics on mobile.
- We have superior analytics available to us on mobile than on PC thanks to Mobage, which is not on PC.
- We will not be running analytics on the balance file modding tool as we want you to share your reasoning for making changes with us so as to provide depth and context.
[/ul] Hope that answers your questions![/quote]Well session length seems meaningless. I often let godus run in the back round while i do other things. Like watching Stargate( damm you Ba'al^^) I even baked muffins/ cupcakes while waiting for the timers^^ [/quote]That's why having your info along with your balance files will be really useful  |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2014 12:43:27 GMT
Okay, this is what I have found out so far: - We do have analytics on PC, giving us the ability to see how many users are playing, when they are playing, session length etc.
- Our early experiences of analytics on PC fed into how we now do analytics on mobile.
- We have superior analytics available to us on mobile than on PC thanks to Mobage, which is not on PC.
- We will not be running analytics on the balance file modding tool as we want you to share your reasoning for making changes with us so as to provide depth and context.
[/ul] Hope that answers your questions![/quote]I'm guessing those metrics are sourced via Steam and not Godus-internal polling mechanics? |
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Post by 13thGeneral on Aug 20, 2014 12:44:50 GMT
Okay, this is what I have found out so far: - We do have analytics on PC, giving us the ability to see how many users are playing, when they are playing, session length etc.
- Our early experiences of analytics on PC fed into how we now do analytics on mobile.
- We have superior analytics available to us on mobile than on PC thanks to Mobage, which is not on PC.
- We will not be running analytics on the balance file modding tool as we want you to share your reasoning for making changes with us so as to provide depth and context.
[/ul] Hope that answers your questions![/quote]Well session length seems meaningless. I often let godus run in the back round while i do other things. Like watching Stargate( damm you Ba'al^^) I even baked muffins/ cupcakes while waiting for the timers^^ [/quote] And that's why context is so vital. You have to understand why people play however long they play for; whether it's enriching gameplay, interesting story, enjoyment from exploration, or from forced waiting or overtly punishing mechanics, all are extremely essential to understanding the numbers. And that is why they want us to describe our mmotivation behind our balancing choices. It's not optimal, but at least it's a start. |
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Post by Danjal on Aug 20, 2014 17:51:54 GMT
I'm oddly curious to see some of those statistics regarding the Pit of Doom and various other PC behaviour patterns.
I suspect that a lot of PC players idle-run their game and make great use of the Pit...
Given the sample group available here.
This observation is also based on the fact that this version seemed to have a lot more retention than the previous updates.
Which I surmise is because people can use gems to 'cheat' their way past the timers.
Also as an FYI - I've ran my own game in offline mode because I only have a single network cable in my room and its currently connected to my laptop.
Godus runs on my PC so I've been depriving the cans of my play-data (if you want I could send over some of my files but I doubt a single instance like that would be of much assistance).
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Post by hardly on Aug 20, 2014 19:35:37 GMT
Okay, this is what I have found out so far: - We do have analytics on PC, giving us the ability to see how many users are playing, when they are playing, session length etc.
- Our early experiences of analytics on PC fed into how we now do analytics on mobile.
- We have superior analytics available to us on mobile than on PC thanks to Mobage, which is not on PC.
- We will not be running analytics on the balance file modding tool as we want you to share your reasoning for making changes with us so as to provide depth and context.
[/ul] Hope that answers your questions![/quote] For now I'm going to assume anything that George hadn't mentioned is collected isn't. If George wants to expand his list he can do that at any time and ill review my position on this. As 13th gen says it sounds like the information they collect is from the steam client. This makes sense because we know the game itself doesn't need to communicate with a server. If this is true it is really frustrating. Peter has been going on about analytics, and watching how we are playing. I was hoping he was getting fed insight on clicks, time spent sculpting, belief expenditure, etc. If this isn't the case then I say this is another lie. There is just no way you can read the various statements from Peter and not get the impression that he is gather in game data on activity and play styles in the PC build. If it turns out there are no real PC analytics then that is further evidence that Peter is really only thinking and talking about mobile. Everything done since October last year appears to be about mobile. How many times has he talked about analytics? If that only applies to mobile then that is a big fuck you to PC. As others have pointed out the analytics George does mention are useless. |
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Post by greay on Aug 20, 2014 19:36:06 GMT
Okay, this is what I have found out so far: - We do have analytics on PC, giving us the ability to see how many users are playing, when they are playing, session length etc.
- Our early experiences of analytics on PC fed into how we now do analytics on mobile.
- We have superior analytics available to us on mobile than on PC thanks to Mobage, which is not on PC.
- We will not be running analytics on the balance file modding tool as we want you to share your reasoning for making changes with us so as to provide depth and context.
[/ul] Hope that answers your questions![/quote]Awesome, thanks! That's reassuring, I think? I'd be interested in more about how analytics are used across the platforms, but this is definitely not a priority. Some questions that come to mind: - What are some decisions that have been made based on analytics information?
- What's something notable/surprising you've learned by looking at the analytics?
- It's expected that play style is going to be different between mobile & PC. Are there any unexpected differences between them?
- Are there any analytics that you use to gauge unhappiness/frustration?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2014 19:41:03 GMT
Okay, this is what I have found out so far: - We do have analytics on PC, giving us the ability to see how many users are playing, when they are playing, session length etc.
- Our early experiences of analytics on PC fed into how we now do analytics on mobile.
- We have superior analytics available to us on mobile than on PC thanks to Mobage, which is not on PC.
- We will not be running analytics on the balance file modding tool as we want you to share your reasoning for making changes with us so as to provide depth and context.
[/ul] Hope that answers your questions![/quote] For now I'm going to assume anything that George hadn't mentioned is collected isn't. If George wants to expand his list he can do that at any time and ill review my position on this. As 13th gen says it sounds like the information they collect is from the steam client. This makes sense because we know the game itself doesn't need to communicate with a server. If this is true it is really frustrating. Peter has been going on about analytics, and watching how we are playing. I was hoping he was getting fed insight on clicks, time spent sculpting, belief expenditure, etc. If this isn't the case then I say this is another lie. There is just no way you can read the various statements from Peter and not get the impression that he is gather in game data on activity and play styles in the PC build. If it turns out there are no real PC analytics then that is further evidence that Peter is really only thinking and talking about mobile. Everything done since October last year appears to be about mobile. How many times has he talked about analytics? If that only applies to mobile then that is a big fuck you to PC. As others have pointed out the analytics George does mention are useless.[/quote]IF what you suggest is true... Wouldn't that just be massively disappointing. Finding out that 22cans hasn't been collecting anything aside from some superficial Steam data... at all. It certainly would make all of Peter's analytic grand-standing fall flat... At least as far as the PC crowd is concerned. It would also make sense why they are so amped about the balance files...  |
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Post by Danjal on Aug 20, 2014 20:40:17 GMT
Considering how little we've heard about it? I think its safe to assume that the information they've gathered through Analytics is both shallow aswell as without context.
The results we have observed from updates since also do not give a clear indication that they've observed our playstyles and learned from them.
Other than the repetative "YOU SCULPT TOO MUCH" complaints.
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Post by banned on Aug 21, 2014 1:41:07 GMT
In defense of their silence, (well, beyond the press should shame them from ever speaking in public again, anyway),
How much can analytic tell them beyond
"played for 5 minutes, quit, waited 10 hours, played 5 minutes while punished for not paying attention to the "nothing to do unless you buy in the store" piece of shit."
Really don't understand why anyone is shocked they got nothing going since they finally admit their dev. doc. is a blank sheet.
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Post by earlparvisjam on Aug 21, 2014 8:18:58 GMT
Okay, this is what I have found out so far: - We do have analytics on PC, giving us the ability to see how many users are playing, when they are playing, session length etc.
- Our early experiences of analytics on PC fed into how we now do analytics on mobile.
- We have superior analytics available to us on mobile than on PC thanks to Mobage, which is not on PC.
- We will not be running analytics on the balance file modding tool as we want you to share your reasoning for making changes with us so as to provide depth and context.
[/ul] Hope that answers your questions![/quote] From March on Gamasutra: Care to figure out just what he was talking about back then?! I know they had in-game analytics working at some point around then because I packet sniffed game.22test.net and 22godcollect.gamesanalytics.net when I ran Godus back then. Last I'd heard about analytics, we "sculpt too much" and that information came from somewhere... |
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Post by hardly on Aug 21, 2014 8:28:05 GMT
While im sure George will provide us with a more comprehensive answer at the earliest possible opportunity, after all it is just a simple statement of fact, it would be incredibly amusing if there were no in game PC analytics.
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Post by Danjal on Aug 21, 2014 12:15:44 GMT
I'm not so sure. It seems that George is being kept in the dark almost as much as we are because the powers that be know that we won't like the answer we'd get (for good reasons...)
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Post by earlparvisjam on Aug 21, 2014 13:11:18 GMT
I'm not so sure. It seems that George is being kept in the dark almost as much as we are because the powers that be know that we won't like the answer we'd get (for good reasons...) I got a bit paranoid back when that thread was discussed and all of this evasiveness is bringing that back. This is just the latest in the large number of contradictions that the developers have posited. It's pretty clear that George isn't the one trying to confuse the situation, but looks particularly damning for 22Cans. Heck, last I heard, they have at least one person dedicated to analytics. If that's still true, what the holy hell is that person doing if all they're doing is analyzing Steam info? It's becoming clear why people were thinking I was being daft when I went on about them gathering tool configuration data using analytics. Most people either missed the whole conversation or forgot about it... |
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Post by Qetesh on Aug 21, 2014 13:59:37 GMT
If it was my company and my livelihood, there would be no way in hell I would not be running them. There's no excuse not to be. They have bad press, bad reviews, pissed off backers, pissed off consumers and they know it, and now I am to believe they don't track where this is headed? If that was the case..........I would just have to shake my head and say, you will get what you deserve.
I continue to hope this is not the case and they are doing everything they can to fix this cluster fuck. Sorry but I can't think of another term at this point after having played the game for last week straight.
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