Lord Ba'al
Supreme Deity
Posts: 6,260
Pledge level: Half a Partner
I like: Cats; single malt Scotch; Stargate; Amiga; fried potatoes; retro gaming; cheese; snickers; sticky tape.
I don't like: Dimples in the bottom of scotch bottles; Facebook games masquerading as godgames.
Steam: stonelesscutter
GOG: stonelesscutter
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Post by Lord Ba'al on Jun 30, 2014 10:16:09 GMT
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Post by Crumpy Six on Jun 30, 2014 10:27:23 GMT
I just don't GET this. I don't see any of Peter's passions, beliefs or ideals reflected in Godus, or in what Godus is going to be based on the roadmap and upcoming features. He may be going on a wonderful journey of learning, discovery and fascinating experiences whilst running his own studio, but for the end-user Godus is just an unremarkable and badly-designed attempt at capitalising on nostalgia for Black and White/Populous.
I'm also continually perplexed by PM's claims that monetisation in Godus is different to the way it's presented in other F2P games. He obviously believes that monetisation in Godus is not about "addiction", but a lot of people describe Godus as being "addictive" including the community team themselves. If the game is addictive and the monetisation is part of the "addictive" process (ie. speeding up your progress through the game) how is Godus not also monetising addiction?
This is a serious question. Can anyone at 22Cans explain the thinking here?
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Post by Qetesh on Jun 30, 2014 10:42:15 GMT
This sounds like he wants to blend the games into one new genre, but there is a problem with that. I don't want to play a new type of genre game. I like that division and I don't see anything wrong with it. I think that a good PC game with a store for superficial items is perfect already. I don't mind paying 40 dollars for a game upfront and never having to pay a penny again. I don't want any F2p mechanics in my game. I don't want any chores in my game either.
I think of this and it makes me think of people wanting everyone to have the same size car. They would make a medium size car for all so that there would be no more division of car owners. That would be horrible. I might want a small car to save on gas and because I don't like to drive bigger cars and I don't like the look of them, I like small cars. Or, I might want a big car because I have a large family, or ton of stuff to tote around in day to day life, or I just like the look and feel of a bigger car. This should be my choice.
The games are no different. As a consumer, I should be able to choose what type of game I want. I am the customer and I am supposed to be the one that is always right and catered to. This should not be the other way around. I don't want the gaming industry deciding for me what types of games to play nor do I see a bit of a problem as a gamer with this division.
I get that this is now a way to justify the F2p mechanics in the game, okay, so this is the F2p mobile game, I'm over that, but please don't tell me that my PC game is going to be anything like any F2p to create a new genre or meld some division that I don't care about. I just wanted a fun PC God game.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2014 10:56:52 GMT
That's good to know. I had some concerns before today. I am sure it will be a somewhat ... zen like experience.
He only forgot that it's not only his money that he burns.
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Lord Ba'al
Supreme Deity
Posts: 6,260
Pledge level: Half a Partner
I like: Cats; single malt Scotch; Stargate; Amiga; fried potatoes; retro gaming; cheese; snickers; sticky tape.
I don't like: Dimples in the bottom of scotch bottles; Facebook games masquerading as godgames.
Steam: stonelesscutter
GOG: stonelesscutter
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Post by Lord Ba'al on Jun 30, 2014 10:59:40 GMT
The games are no different. As a consumer, I should be able to choose what type of game I want. By extension of your line of thought, people should also be free to choose a game that blends mobile and PC together and people should certainly be free to choose to create such a game.
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Lord Ba'al
Supreme Deity
Posts: 6,260
Pledge level: Half a Partner
I like: Cats; single malt Scotch; Stargate; Amiga; fried potatoes; retro gaming; cheese; snickers; sticky tape.
I don't like: Dimples in the bottom of scotch bottles; Facebook games masquerading as godgames.
Steam: stonelesscutter
GOG: stonelesscutter
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Post by Lord Ba'al on Jun 30, 2014 11:00:58 GMT
That's good to know. I had some concerns before today. I am sure it will be a somewhat ... zen like experience.
He only forgot that it's not only his money that he burns.
I believe there's a little store around the corner that sells old produce at bargain prices.
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Post by Qetesh on Jun 30, 2014 11:01:27 GMT
The games are no different. As a consumer, I should be able to choose what type of game I want. By extension of your line of thought, people should also be free to choose a game that blends mobile and PC together and people should certainly be free to choose to create such a game. Sure, as long as all three exist then. When you read the article is sounds like PM thinks this is for the greater good since this division is something that is not portrayed in a good light.
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Post by Monkeythumbz on Jun 30, 2014 11:01:47 GMT
I think Peter is referring to the concept of the end product that we're still working towards, rather than Godus as it exists right now on PC.
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Lord Ba'al
Supreme Deity
Posts: 6,260
Pledge level: Half a Partner
I like: Cats; single malt Scotch; Stargate; Amiga; fried potatoes; retro gaming; cheese; snickers; sticky tape.
I don't like: Dimples in the bottom of scotch bottles; Facebook games masquerading as godgames.
Steam: stonelesscutter
GOG: stonelesscutter
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Post by Lord Ba'al on Jun 30, 2014 11:02:25 GMT
Sure, as long as all three exist then. When you read the article is sounds like PM thinks this is for the greater good since this division is something that is not portrayed in a good light. And he is free to think whatever he wants.
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Post by Qetesh on Jun 30, 2014 11:06:34 GMT
I think Peter is referring to the concept of the end product that we're still working towards, rather than Godus as it exists right now on PC. This thought saddens me, because it sounds like the end product is something that he wishes to be a melding of F2p and PC. Why does he think gamers want to meld the two? I for one, don't. It's not about changing the industry to me, it's about being able to play a game that I want and having fun while doing it without any form of F2p in it. I am thinking perhaps we should make a poll and ask that exact question. I am curious to see the results.
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Post by Qetesh on Jun 30, 2014 11:07:21 GMT
Sure, as long as all three exist then. When you read the article is sounds like PM thinks this is for the greater good since this division is something that is not portrayed in a good light. And he is free to think whatever he wants. Sure but what about what the consumer wants? I think I shall go ahead and make that poll.
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Post by julians on Jun 30, 2014 11:09:28 GMT
I think Peter is referring to the concept of the end product that we're still working towards, rather than Godus as it exists right now on PC. Too bad that the KS was for a small game with 9 month development plan, and not for whatever is being 'reinvented' now.
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Post by Crumpy Six on Jun 30, 2014 11:25:45 GMT
I think Peter is referring to the concept of the end product that we're still working towards, rather than Godus as it exists right now on PC. Yeah, I kind of figured this would be the response. But this doesn't really wash. The monetisation, for example - I gather you buy gems and spend them to auto-complete timers, right? Is this going to dramatically change in some way? If not my point still stands.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 30, 2014 11:45:13 GMT
I think Peter is referring to the concept of the end product that we're still working towards, rather than Godus as it exists right now on PC. Why doesn't he tell us what his concept of the end product is? Maybe we can understand better what he is doing right now. Anyway, that was something i asked him more than 12 month ago (shortly after my request for the design document - which we all know now will be done after the game is done), but never got an answer. Maybe it's because he will do the thinking about how the game should be after the game is done, too? Would explain all the Information we have until know - delicious, zen like, not f2p, eight.
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Post by nerdyvonnerdling on Jun 30, 2014 15:55:41 GMT
I think Peter is referring to the concept of the end product that we're still working towards, rather than Godus as it exists right now on PC. Yeah, I kind of figured this would be the response. But this doesn't really wash. The monetisation, for example - I gather you buy gems and spend them to auto-complete timers, right? Is this going to dramatically change in some way? If not my point still stands. I don't know about timers, but in some of the screens it was apparent you can buy gems, and spend the gems on sticker packs.
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Post by earlparvisjam on Jun 30, 2014 16:00:49 GMT
I think Peter is referring to the concept of the end product that we're still working towards, rather than Godus as it exists right now on PC. Even with the road map, I don't think anyone knows what the end product is going to look like. The biggest thing Godus lacks on every level is a point. Homeworld lacks any goal or objective. There's no challenge, and even the timeline isn't an achievement so much as a random chance progression. Adding Hubworld isn't going to change that any. If anything, it's going to make Homeworld look like a lame game play prototype. Godus is two separate games using the same framework. Homeworld is for mobile platforms and younger players whereas Hubworld is for pc and hardcore players. I don't see how monetization will fit into Hubworld at all and can't see where most hardcore players will stay with Homeworld once a real challenge is presented. If they'd been more focused on separating these two this way from the start, we'd all be a lot less frustrated right now.
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Post by nerdyvonnerdling on Jun 30, 2014 16:24:51 GMT
Frankly, his statements just read as empty hyperbole, to me. I'm sure he means well, I've no reason to doubt that, but it just reads as silly, ridiculous hype. Take this - “Gaming is a new form of entertainment, that will be more dominant than film, television, or music. How close are we at the moment to that?” asked Molyneux, quoting Clive Sinclair.
How is that not just hype? Gaming isn't a new form of entertainment, to start with. You can go to just about any museum and find ancient Egyptian games dug out of tombs, and I wouldn't be surprised if there were some homo habilis fishbone gameset artifacts out there. Video games are a new expression of that, but gaming is old. Just like movies and tv are new expressions of plays and storytelling. Music, undeniably ancient. Guessing which one will be 'the most dominant' just seems like empty nonsense. How on Earth would you begin to 'rank' those things?
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Post by Qetesh on Jun 30, 2014 16:42:27 GMT
Frankly, his statements just read as empty hyperbole, to me. I'm sure he means well, I've no reason to doubt that, but it just reads as silly, ridiculous hype. Take this - “Gaming is a new form of entertainment, that will be more dominant than film, television, or music. How close are we at the moment to that?” asked Molyneux, quoting Clive Sinclair. How is that not just hype? Gaming isn't a new form of entertainment, to start with. You can go to just about any museum and find ancient Egyptian games dug out of tombs, and I wouldn't be surprised if there were some homo habilis fishbone gameset artifacts out there. Video games are a new expression of that, but gaming is old. Just like movies and tv are new expressions of plays and storytelling. Music, undeniably ancient. Guessing which one will be 'the most dominant' just seems like empty nonsense. How on Earth would you begin to 'rank' those things? This is so true for me. I don't think people will want any of them to be more dominant in one way or the other either. If I feel like playing a video game, I do. If I want to watch a movie or TV show, I do. Sometimes I just like to listen to music and other times I just want to read a book. It all comes down to what I am in the mood for. It's funny (and ironic) even in the game of Sims you have a "fun" meter and certain things provide certain "levels" of fun. I even get tired of picking the same ones in there and that is not even me doing it but actually playing a game. I would get tired of any of them if it was the one I did most of the time. "Variety is the spice of life" and I don't see gaming ever becoming something that people wrap all their leisure activities around over any others. There is nothing as amazing as going to a broadway play or symphony and gaming cannot compare to watching my favorite characters play out on Suits or Star Trek. Gaming is something cool to do while chilling at home, you can't really relax with a tablet on the beach like reading a book, or dance along to your favorite song, and snuggle up with your loved one while watching a movie together. It is a whole different experience but ultimately again it just comes down to using my free time to spend doing as I wish be it Music, Movies, Tv, or a video game.
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Post by Monkeythumbz on Jun 30, 2014 17:48:50 GMT
Gaming is something cool to do while chilling at home, you can't really relax with a tablet on the beach like reading a book, or dance along to your favorite song, and snuggle up with your loved one while watching a movie together. It is a whole different experience but ultimately again it just comes down to using my free time to spend doing as I wish be it Music, Movies, Tv, or a video game. Funnily enough, I think that's part of our vision for Godus (on mobile, at least).
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Post by Qetesh on Jun 30, 2014 18:05:29 GMT
Gaming is something cool to do while chilling at home, you can't really relax with a tablet on the beach like reading a book, or dance along to your favorite song, and snuggle up with your loved one while watching a movie together. It is a whole different experience but ultimately again it just comes down to using my free time to spend doing as I wish be it Music, Movies, Tv, or a video game. Funnily enough, I think that's part of our vision for Godus (on mobile, at least). The beach is not somewhere I would want to play video games at, but that is just me. I also would never even take a Kindle to the beach. The blowing sand and sea water in the air does not seem to be very good for electronic devices. Maybe if they were hella cheaper and it did not matter if they got ruined but for me a beach is best with a good old fashioned paperbook, it is gets ruined, I get put out by less than 10 bucks. I can read a few pages, flip over and put down book. Flip back when I want and read a few more and there is nothing making me read the book accept my desire to do so. Mobile Video games for me are for trains, waiting for appointments and killing time when needed. A console or PC game is something that is done when at home and I feel like playing a game.
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