Disagreeing = Opression

I use to get angry with Muir then I looked at his train2game stuff and started to have nothing but sympathy and compassion for him.

The best advise I ever gave him having seen his development efforts was "Have you thought abut going into testing?". He didn't take it well from memory...

In all fairness, this particular exchange (unless another near-identical one happened recently that I missed) took place a few months ago, and George stepped in to warn Denny Crane when he saw what was going on. I do think Muir's reaction was ridiculous, but this is the kind of biased inconsistency we're used to seeing from him. At least the other mods tend to be more consistent in their approach. I think Muir genuinely does TRY to be a good mod but is very poor at recognising appropriate moments to intervene.

The Steam forums are crappy. On most forums you'd be expected to take things to Private Messages if they get derailed or overly personal, but on Steam you can only send PMs to people on your Friend list. Since most people aren't going to add random forum-people to their Friend list this won't usually happen. I tried to add Muir once to discuss some stuff and he just declined it, so that was the end of that (any time I tried to address him on the forum he edited my post to delete the comment!).

I can see why the community team are frustrated by positive threads being 'poisoned' with negativity, but the negativity is definitely goaded on by the likes of users like Denny Crane and Dunjeon - does Dunjeon ever post in a way that is NOT openly insulting to critics? Maybe the 22Cans forums should be the special postive-about-Godus forum where a higher degree of control is exercised and the Steam forum should be allowed to go a bit wild (as in untended, not rampant).

Wait, who banned you - when was this?

As for Denny Crane, you do make some good points. As Matthew mentions, the mod team have been informed and we'll take appropriate action.

It was many moons ago; right after the winter silence I believe. I had posted something out of frustration - an analogy, I believe - that was rather tactless and somewhat out of line, but should have had at least been granted the opportunity to retract or appologize for my comment; especially for a first ever offense. However, I was not warned, nor afforded the chance to recover. Instead, I was simply banned and informed of my wrong doing (either a 24 time-out, or 3-day ban. I don't recal which). Justified or not - and although, in retrospect, I agree I was out of sorts - the matter could have been handled better. I won't call the individual out, because that's just not my style (nor fair to that individual for essentially performing thier duties). The point is that there are still some areas for improvement on hwo the reps deal with the community, specifically in maintaining a more even-handed balance with thier moderation in regards to behavior.

By the way if I recall correctly denny already received a warning by george a few days before that happened as people complained about him, so that wasn't his first offense either. (and at that point people already complained a lot about him and how he was getting away with that stuff).

Yes I can understand that this must be frustrating as well and they can of course freely voice that.

But speaking about disrespect against the thread opener and flame-baiting is something different than just being personally frustrated about the lack of positivity and asking people to be nice is not the same as telling them how it would be possible to interpret their posts as derailing and flame-posting and then pointing out how that is against the steam rules.

I remember that people had been banned 30 days with the official reason to be simply off-topic (which was even arguably) or flame-baiting. Now people get accused of derailing threads and being disrespectful even though they actually argue about the topic of the thread, they just argue from a different standpoint.


That post was a month ago from Muir in that thread:

steamcommunity.com/app/232810/discussions/0/46476145476576811/#c46476145595250454

Op stated that he supports Peter and linked a interview in which peter cried in front of the camera which was the reason that he supports peter despite over-promising again. (OP was still stating that he is not happy with the current state of godus). That thread itself already started with some critique.

earl_parvisjam has just pointed out that this wasn't the first time that peter was publicly sorry for over-promising in the past. So did drake. Ein talked about getting sold something different then promised but was still responding to the linked interview.

I can't see how this is off-topic or disrespectful, all three were responding to the article that OP linked and none of them was overly negative about godus.

Disagreeing isn't necessary off-topic especially when people were just pointing out that similar interviews happened in the past (drake linked a handful) like the one OP linked.

I really want to know how it can be considered disrespectful to just disagree or stating facts. In that post Muir actually addressed specific posts which do not in any way insult OP, they solely address the link of OP.

Its not like these threads had been introduced with "I want to know what you like about Godus, please detain from sarcasm" in which case posts pointing out all bad things would indeed be unfair towards OP and off-topic. In my opinion it should be the decision of OP if he wants a discussion and different opinions or not, I don't think that someone who posts one opinion necessary wants that every poster in his thread has to share his opinion. He might even want to argue about that topic, for example theFirstDeity argued with others by pointing out how settlements had already been changed in the latest patches and the game in his opinion got better over time.

OP could just as well convince other people or at least make them reconsider some things as it could happen the other way around and the likehood of the former could become greater if the upcoming patches do really improve godus.


That post you linked was a response to the post that OP later apologized for himself. It's still nowhere comparable to Denny crane or some others where Muir said that he couldn't see any problem with. It doesn't make use of harsh language and the biggest insult that I could find was calling OP egoistical and biased.

People had already been banned for being off-topic in the past. So if muir starts to talk about the steam rules and people not just being off-topic but derailing the thread and flame-baiting and rage-posting and trolling it can in my opinion be easily seen as a threat.

And as Earl put it:


So I might shouldn't had been felt addressed by Muir but since he wasn't clear about who he was addressing and for what reason, just telling how he could possibly interpret some posts as rage-posting and flame-baiting if he wanted to, its ambiguous.



I hadn't read it that way and I think you made a fair point.

Before I say anything, I want to point out the post that elicited the response you linked to:


I am so angry right now I could spit fire.  You called ME out!  I never said one word to or about TheFirstDiety before this.  He initiated things by insulting me and YOU have the gall to try to make me the problem?!  So far, I've received no private messages about my actions so I guess I wasn't violating any rules, but every single one of the moderator postings on there felt like veiled attacks at me for having the audacity to fight back when I was insulted.  I briefly tried to respond to TFD's continual misinterpretation of what I said and dismissal of everything as "flamebait" but feel like there's no point.  At best, the OP isn't listening to what I'm saying and at worst, I'm concerned at the passive hostility I'm feeling from the Moderators. 

I've tried to be respectful to moderators but it's hard when I feel like they're being antagonistic.  To an extent, I expect Aynen to whip out pom poms and start cheering, with his rose-tinted view of things, in this situation.  Muir loves to get heavy handed, so I'm not too surprised.  But when moderators are responding with clear hypocracy, I lose all respect.  TheFirstDeity's apology for the insult was a breach of Steam Forum rules and YOU DID NOTHING.  It is against the rules to circumvent the profanity filter and he did it twice. 

Here, I'll emphasize it for you:


A little advice, if you see me come anywhere close to insulting another poster, it's going to be in response to an insult to me.  That thread, and what you've posted on here has done a lot of harm to what respect you've built up in the few months you've been around.  (QFT, indeed...)

What blatant "good cop, bad cop" bull shit! he tried to feed you.  Sorry thumbs, but if you gave a rat's ass what Muir the "can do no wrong" does, the care would be evident.  Twit serves your paid goals.  That is how it works, we get it.  But please show some respect.

I agree there's no conspiracy, but it's entirely their (the actual employees) choice to have the representation that they have, and if they behave (as they clearly do) in a biased and hypocritical fashion, the responsible parties are the actual employees, not the volunteers. That's my two cents, anyways, for whatever it's worth.

I've mentioned this before, but I'm pretty sure Muir has a friend/personal connection who works at 22Cans and this may explain why he's still a mod.