Lord Ba'al
Supreme Deity
Posts: 6,260
Pledge level: Half a Partner
I like: Cats; single malt Scotch; Stargate; Amiga; fried potatoes; retro gaming; cheese; snickers; sticky tape.
I don't like: Dimples in the bottom of scotch bottles; Facebook games masquerading as godgames.
Steam: stonelesscutter
GOG: stonelesscutter
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Post by Lord Ba'al on Jul 26, 2015 0:44:07 GMT
Forgot to remove the lock after moving the posts here. My bad.
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Post by Gmr Leon on Jul 26, 2015 1:23:02 GMT
Right, I think some people are still missing the plot here. These are the posts that the person(s) leaving the forum wrote in regards to what "sours the forum overall":\ Food for thought for everyone, I'm sure. Now, here's the thing. 22Cans has made it rather clear that they consider these updates as feedback threads. Saying "I don't like X, I believe it should be Y, and and I really think communication on Z is making it difficult to believe that our feedback is being considered." is feedback, and I can't quite see how it's harming anyone or anything. After all, the current issues people have with Combat have a cause, and if 22Cans is clearly able to rectify that cause it is on us to make them aware of that. Another bone of contention, perhaps even more important than the above, is this tripe about how "bringing up the the baggage of the past" is "hurting the interactivity between the community and the studio, impacting negatively on the relationship between us and 22cans, and leading to a decreased willingness on the part of 22cans to interact with us". Poppycock. For all intents and purposes, there is no functional community/developer relationship due to the "baggage of the present" and this thread is a perfect example of that. Aynen came in here and posted the same generic "We love your feedback, wait and see" line that he's practiced for the last two years and the PR manager posted a nonsensical reaction image instead of actually, you know, doing PR. Not quite sure why we should throw softballs to 22Cans for more of that, but maybe I'm the only one who doesn't like bargain-bin platitudes being dolled up as "community interaction". Edit: And this has very little to do with "prior" negativity or ill-will or disappointment from the prior 22Cans administration. 22Cans had the opportunity for a fresh start with Godus development and PR with Simon and Colin, the fact that they've chosen to gleefully double down on Molyneux's plan for the game and ignore/antagonize the community is an indictment in and of itself. Maybe I'm being a little pedantic here, but I hardly see the "new behavior" as doubling down on anything (which to my mind would mean a resurgence and increased action in said direction) so much as a continuation of the unfortunate status quo we've been witness to for ages now. Also, as someone who was the last to really put forth any effort whatsoever into getting 22cans to pull its head out of its ass and communicate with us near the end of last year, I think I can safely say that while it won't amount to much (if anything, it seems like we made them realize just how bad of a situation they were in) it does lead to something more to put our ill will on the backburner long enough to attempt to talk things out. We don't have to forget shit (none of us who engaged in that effort did, you can ask anyone who participated in that, be it 13thGeneral, Lord Ba'al, Qetesh, Danjal, hardly, Spiderweb, etc.), but we don't have to drag it about everywhere either, because despite what you might think, it really does fuck with the comms because 22cans is just like that (whatever you want to call that, I'll leave that up to you). Heck, simon22cans's pretty much made as much clear as their policy, which is to say, "We know you're going to talk shit, good for you, but we're interested in feedback." Comments like this (no offense Mandrake), aren't very constructive feedback: What a convoluted and excessive way to...basically clone the Army Camp from Clash of Clans. *facedesks* So how long did this take to sort out, and what is next? Toying with half a dozen algorithms to suddenly figure out how to make a settlement be able to feed itself without their God Click Janitor? Why would I give a fuck about the question after that opening? If I'm sifting through a bunch of stuff, I might glance and see that comparison and dismiss it, not inappropriately I think, but because once you've seen the mobile comparison in any post, you get a sense of where it's going from there (which generally isn't a very productive place). By now, they know that's what we're going to think, and they know we're not going to believe any roadmap, given our prior experience with one spontaneously combusting and getting sucked out a window before it went anywhere. Their rep's so trashed and we're so burnt out on their bullshit, they know we're not gonna buy anything they say and they know they're lucky to get even the tiniest bit of feedback whatsoever. They drip feed us, we drip feed them, because there's barely anything left to this whole mess at this point. Besides that, they've already said outright they have nothing to say on what's next until this is all over with, so that just adds to how easily dismissed the above post could be. Not that I disagree with it, but it seems to me a perfect example of what they're going to probably ignore (rightly or wrongly). |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2015 2:16:46 GMT
Back to one of my previous points - if they wish for feedback, first they're going to have to give indication that they're actually accepting feedback, along with giving something that could offer reason for feedback.
This stale celebration of Combat was old months ago, now it's insulting.
Quid pro quo - if 22cans wants us to speak nicely of them, they can meet us halfway and give reason for us to.
We've only been telling them what would make us speak kindly of them, so...what's the problem?
We've been giving them feedback - they just don't give a fuck unless it is in the narrow confines they draw.
Sorry if I get a little despondent at that kind of bullshit treatment of a community that naturally will only prompt contempt.
See: devtroll
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2015 4:11:19 GMT
Right, I think some people are still missing the plot here. These are the posts that the person(s) leaving the forum wrote in regards to what "sours the forum overall":\ Food for thought for everyone, I'm sure. Now, here's the thing. 22Cans has made it rather clear that they consider these updates as feedback threads. Saying "I don't like X, I believe it should be Y, and and I really think communication on Z is making it difficult to believe that our feedback is being considered." is feedback, and I can't quite see how it's harming anyone or anything. After all, the current issues people have with Combat have a cause, and if 22Cans is clearly able to rectify that cause it is on us to make them aware of that. Another bone of contention, perhaps even more important than the above, is this tripe about how "bringing up the the baggage of the past" is "hurting the interactivity between the community and the studio, impacting negatively on the relationship between us and 22cans, and leading to a decreased willingness on the part of 22cans to interact with us". Poppycock. For all intents and purposes, there is no functional community/developer relationship due to the "baggage of the present" and this thread is a perfect example of that. Aynen came in here and posted the same generic "We love your feedback, wait and see" line that he's practiced for the last two years and the PR manager posted a nonsensical reaction image instead of actually, you know, doing PR. Not quite sure why we should throw softballs to 22Cans for more of that, but maybe I'm the only one who doesn't like bargain-bin platitudes being dolled up as "community interaction". Edit: And this has very little to do with "prior" negativity or ill-will or disappointment from the prior 22Cans administration. 22Cans had the opportunity for a fresh start with Godus development and PR with Simon and Colin, the fact that they've chosen to gleefully double down on Molyneux's plan for the game and ignore/antagonize the community is an indictment in and of itself. Maybe I'm being a little pedantic here, but I hardly see the "new behavior" as doubling down on anything (which to my mind would mean a resurgence and increased action in said direction) so much as a continuation of the unfortunate status quo we've been witness to for ages now. Also, as someone who was the last to really put forth any effort whatsoever into getting 22cans to pull its head out of its ass and communicate with us near the end of last year, I think I can safely say that while it won't amount to much (if anything, it seems like we made them realize just how bad of a situation they were in) it does lead to something more to put our ill will on the backburner long enough to attempt to talk things out. We don't have to forget shit (none of us who engaged in that effort did, you can ask anyone who participated in that, be it 13thGeneral, Lord Ba'al, Qetesh, Danjal, hardly, Spiderweb, etc.), but we don't have to drag it about everywhere either, because despite what you might think, it really does fuck with the comms because 22cans is just like that (whatever you want to call that, I'll leave that up to you). Heck, simon22cans's pretty much made as much clear as their policy, which is to say, "We know you're going to talk shit, good for you, but we're interested in feedback." Comments like this (no offense Mandrake), aren't very constructive feedback: What a convoluted and excessive way to...basically clone the Army Camp from Clash of Clans. *facedesks* So how long did this take to sort out, and what is next? Toying with half a dozen algorithms to suddenly figure out how to make a settlement be able to feed itself without their God Click Janitor? Why would I give a fuck about the question after that opening? If I'm sifting through a bunch of stuff, I might glance and see that comparison and dismiss it, not inappropriately I think, but because once you've seen the mobile comparison in any post, you get a sense of where it's going from there (which generally isn't a very productive place). By now, they know that's what we're going to think, and they know we're not going to believe any roadmap, given our prior experience with one spontaneously combusting and getting sucked out a window before it went anywhere. Their rep's so trashed and we're so burnt out on their bullshit, they know we're not gonna buy anything they say and they know they're lucky to get even the tiniest bit of feedback whatsoever. They drip feed us, we drip feed them, because there's barely anything left to this whole mess at this point. Besides that, they've already said outright they have nothing to say on what's next until this is all over with, so that just adds to how easily dismissed the above post could be. Not that I disagree with it, but it seems to me a perfect example of what they're going to probably ignore (rightly or wrongly). Again, I think some people are still missing the plot here. This "the community isn't giving Simon and Colin a fair chance with positive feedback" narrative has a couple dozen holes in it, most of which you can find by looking at some of the other "moved" posts, but I think they can all be summed up by an example that keeps floating to the top of my head whenever someone starts sermonizing about how 22Cans just wants some constructive feedback, probably because it's the only example of them actually taking any sort of feedback whatsoever. Anyhow, what happened was that Simon told us he'd be ignoring almost all community feedback, except "positive feedback". Shortly afterward, Colin claimed that the community's feedback on the work of the skeleton crew was "positive", and that this feedback came via a number of upvotes that, strangely enough, were exponentially larger than the number of active community members. Then he locked the thread after being called out for that PR skulduggery and has kept his mouth shut about "positive feedback" since then. So the only "positive feedback" we've seen 22Cans utilize are sockpuppet upvotes to falsify community support and excuse an existing course of action retroactively. I don't think I need to say anything more about that particular example, one would be inclined to believe it speaks for itself. Beyond that, almost all of the community's concerns and issues with the current iteration of Combat are a direct result of Simon's decisions since he became executive director half a year ago. We extended an awful lot of good will to him and Colin, to say nothing of chances and second-chances and do-overs and I think it's fair to say that they have done absolutely nothing to meet us halfway. |
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Post by Crumpy Six on Jul 26, 2015 9:33:13 GMT
With the exception of when Konrad was around, this is the best communications from 22Cans have ever been where Godus is concerned. Regular, nicely-structured dev updates that have clearly had a lot of work put into them. Forum participation both here and on the Steam boards, and answering a large volume of questions (even when the questions are difficult or combatative).
As for what is actually going on at the studio right now... yeah. I don't care about combat. I don't particularly care about multiplayer. It's depressing how they made Godus 1.3 in 9 months, but in over 6 months now they've got next nothing to show for this one feature. A feature that the community isn't even all that interested in, from what I gather. I don't think there's much scope for 22Cans to take on board player feedback at this point because in order to achieve any of their objectives (be it strategic or operational) they need to focus and follow their existing plan (whatever that may be).
Remember that the main resources of the studio, including Simon's time and efforts, are being invested in the Trail. Unless he's just a patsy propped up in front of the Godus customers so Peter Molyneux can take care of the Trail all by himself. That definitely wouldn't surprise me. CEO is a nice title, but he still ultimately reports to PM.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2015 11:29:20 GMT
With the exception of when Konrad was around, this is the best communications from 22Cans have ever been where Godus is concerned. Regular, nicely-structured dev updates that have clearly had a lot of work put into them. Forum participation both here and on the Steam boards, and answering a large volume of questions (even when the questions are difficult or combatative). Participation, maybe. I've seen it how petermolyneux has described, that somehow 22cans want praise without really doing anything for that praise. Some of the posts on Steam have instead been antagonistic where they're just not simply insulting, originally thought to have been a faux pas based upon ignorance. For a bit, it appeared that Simon was pulling a Fragglerock Ampersand. Other places, 22cans have just simply FORGOTTEN. The Kickstarter turned into an absolute wasteland of forgotten and has been since ~Mar 19. They're not too happy over there. This seems to offer a more troubling focus, like a show of activity, while the real problems are effectively ignored. Again, there is the feedback we've given - talking with the devs was considered a golden era of communication and actual Early Access participation. 22cans' response to this feedback? Silence. Mmm-hmm, message received loud and clear: They're afraid of more "leaks" since the last time, from departing developers, and nothing has really changed.Now they're seemingly looking for excuses, and the "we're not getting the praise we want!" thing is just mad. It would take someone really ignoring feedback to consider that the community is all that excited for Combat. 22cans know already how Combat hasn't been impressing folks compared to the base game's design, which is probably why just about every other Godus fansite/forum has effectively closed down but here and on Steam since the Combat "sprint" was started. 22cans' management wants praise for the "Combat Sprint" while keeping development in this condition (the team is effectively still how Peter's management left it, really) and I think that's extremely assholish of them to do, from a development perspective. They're the ones who have to work to earn the trust again of people who have been abused with fraud on a number of levels, so playing them off as giving Simon "nothing he can use" in terms of feedback has been a complete farce. But to base it around the efforts of a team that is still limited and expect praise over it...bonkers and abusive to the developers themselves, really. Yeah, people start to make sour comments about the developer's work, when the developers are probably doing that as the only things they're allowed to do at the 22cans tower. That isn't right, and I do apologise for that, as it wasn't nice to those actually offering effort in this.  If there are any plans, which have only been said enough in feedback to be something that would give people a lot more faith in 22cans' development, then I'm sure both the community and the actual developers would feel a lot better. It is really hard to develop without a solid plan unless you're working upon the video game version of YouTube Poop. That's what I'm starting to feel on this. It certainly would fit the whole "We only want praise for something we're doing that hardly anyone wants." thing. It would also seem to serve as another diversion in a long line of excuses with more mea culpa without any "mea fixing anything". Compared to other development, particularly in other titles at the time, the weekly updates aren't...well, they show more potential issues with development than showcasing the efforts of the developers. Plans, actual communication with the developers, development issues...all the feedback around that seems to be ignored unless it's for praise, and we've seen how "feedback" has been taken in - numerical votes about a fenced-in area. I think it is really rich for 22cans to start suddenly demanding how the community respond to their song and dance. |
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Lord Ba'al
Supreme Deity
Posts: 6,260
Pledge level: Half a Partner
I like: Cats; single malt Scotch; Stargate; Amiga; fried potatoes; retro gaming; cheese; snickers; sticky tape.
I don't like: Dimples in the bottom of scotch bottles; Facebook games masquerading as godgames.
Steam: stonelesscutter
GOG: stonelesscutter
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Post by Lord Ba'al on Jul 26, 2015 12:03:48 GMT
I think it is really rich for 22cans to start suddenly demanding how the community respond to their song and dance. Where does that assertion come from exactly? |
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Post by morsealworth on Jul 26, 2015 12:06:42 GMT
I think it is really rich for 22cans to start suddenly demanding how the community respond to their song and dance. Where does that assertion come from exactly? Steam forums? |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2015 12:13:13 GMT
I think it is really rich for 22cans to start suddenly demanding how the community respond to their song and dance. Where does that assertion come from exactly? How they're paying fuck-all for attention to all else. Feedback, actual problems, development, can all go piss off versus a numerical tally of "positive feedback" and the expectation that we're supposed to be so HAPPY! They haven't stated as much themselves, but have offered that message through their actions in what they choose to address. Actual feedback? That hasn't really been addressed by 22cans unless it's to hug a small parcel of praise to their chests. Rather a tall order for a company that still has a few matters of fraud to attend to, which they've since completely stopped even paying lip-service to, according to the Kickstarter comments. |
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Lord Ba'al
Supreme Deity
Posts: 6,260
Pledge level: Half a Partner
I like: Cats; single malt Scotch; Stargate; Amiga; fried potatoes; retro gaming; cheese; snickers; sticky tape.
I don't like: Dimples in the bottom of scotch bottles; Facebook games masquerading as godgames.
Steam: stonelesscutter
GOG: stonelesscutter
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Post by Lord Ba'al on Jul 26, 2015 12:26:39 GMT
I've been hearing this numerical tally thing a lot lately all across the board. It seems to be proclaimed as being a fact. I would like to know what the basis is for assuming this as a fact.
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Post by morsealworth on Jul 26, 2015 12:32:06 GMT
I've been hearing this numerical tally thing a lot lately all across the board. It seems to be proclaimed as being a fact. I would like to know what the basis is for assuming this as a fact. Did someone possess your body when we weren't looking? The most prominent is this post. Of course, if ou just check Steam forums, you'll see a lot of crap like this that does sum up to that. |
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Lord Ba'al
Supreme Deity
Posts: 6,260
Pledge level: Half a Partner
I like: Cats; single malt Scotch; Stargate; Amiga; fried potatoes; retro gaming; cheese; snickers; sticky tape.
I don't like: Dimples in the bottom of scotch bottles; Facebook games masquerading as godgames.
Steam: stonelesscutter
GOG: stonelesscutter
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Post by Lord Ba'al on Jul 26, 2015 12:35:43 GMT
Just to keep everyone in the loop. I have issued a ban for petermolyneux. (there's a certain irony to the username, I know) The reason for the ban is that he personally insulted me and did not respond on my repeated requests for an apology. Instead he chose to reassert his insult. He has had ample time to respond and has chosen to ignore the situation. The ban will expire on Friday the 31st of July at noon. |
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Post by Crumpy Six on Jul 26, 2015 12:43:22 GMT
I've not seen the stuff on Steam because I'm done with those boards. What I've seen of Simon and Collin here suggests they're resigned to the poor feedback and frustrated by how any attempt to share news from the studio gets dragged into the same place. It's boring and it detracts from the discussion.
Are they taking feedback on board? No, probably not. Nothing new there. 22Cans has always pretended to care about feedback but always ultimately ignored it (with the exception of requests to engage more with the community - let's face it, they are doing that). Are they being honest and open about everything? No. They're probably being more honest than they have been in the past, but there are still some glaring topics they're refusing to comment on. Is it infuriating that they're trying to spin weird things like upvotes as being positive reception? Yes.
Are we getting anywhere by refusing to drop these matters? No. We don't need to be happy about them, but realistically these things aren't aren't going to change and continuing to complain about them benefits no one. As Lord Ba'al has said, it just makes the forums tedious and repetitive and will probably lead to less intereaction from 22Cans. You could argue that there's no value in the interaction we DO get from 22Cans if you like, but I think a lot of people here would disagree and still find the updates interesting.
I don't visit the Steam forums any more because I hate how they're managed. It pissed me off so these boards became my preferred place to talk about Godus and 22Cans. Having grievances relating to the Steam boards brought here makes me feel like I never left. I know Steam activity is a legitmate aspect of how 22Cans handles community relations and this is just my personal view, so I suppose I'm only bringing it up here to add some weight to Ba'al's request that people try to keep on topic when we get some news from the studio.
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Lord Ba'al
Supreme Deity
Posts: 6,260
Pledge level: Half a Partner
I like: Cats; single malt Scotch; Stargate; Amiga; fried potatoes; retro gaming; cheese; snickers; sticky tape.
I don't like: Dimples in the bottom of scotch bottles; Facebook games masquerading as godgames.
Steam: stonelesscutter
GOG: stonelesscutter
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Post by Lord Ba'al on Jul 26, 2015 12:47:51 GMT
I've been hearing this numerical tally thing a lot lately all across the board. It seems to be proclaimed as being a fact. I would like to know what the basis is for assuming this as a fact. Did someone possess your body when we weren't looking? The most prominent is this post. Of course, if ou just check Steam forums, you'll see a lot of crap like this that does sum up to that. Steam forums don't interest me at the moment and have not for a long time now. Perhaps I will revisit them someday. As for the post you quoted, I see a developer mentioning a number of upvotes and downvotes and amount of positive posts versus negative posts in relation to a specific topic. This does not mean that he only looks at the content of the positive posts and not the negative posts. It does not mean that he actually thoroughly reads any posts as opposed to quickly skimming over them. It does not mean that any other topics are viewed in this manner as the example relates to a specific thread. It does not mean that anyone else at 22cans looks at these matters in the same way. It does not mean that this person in question is responsible for polling the overall mood of the community and relaying that information to the rest of the team. To take that post and use it as a foundation for the assertion that 22cans only looks at upvotes and downvotes and doesn't care about any kind of feedback is... well basically the assertion is a house of cards. If there aren't any other arguments to back that up (and they had better be damn good arguments) then I think that this assertion is blown way out of proportions. |
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Post by morsealworth on Jul 26, 2015 13:29:26 GMT
Just as I say, this one is an example of the attitude shown everywhere.
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Post by totallytim on Jul 26, 2015 13:38:08 GMT
That "developer" is Colin and he doesn't read posts? What does he do all day? I sure want his job... Well no, on second thought I actually don't, because my morals prevent me from defending crooks.
Can YOU show some substantial evidence that they read and act on other feedback? There's more reason to believe that they use the vote system and comments on the announcements pages, since it seems they are going on their marry mobile way. If we're wrong why don't they clear it up? It's been brought up several times on this forum for the last 3 weeks. I'm sure someone could sacrifice 15min of his or her time and explain what it all means.
Also petermolyneux didn't insult you. He quoted you on saying that the recent forum activity is hurting our/your relationship with 22cans and sad that that's a load of balls, since the current relationship is pretty much non existent and I agree with him on that. Than you said he could fuck off. Well nice..
I'm not defending his somewhat poor choice of words, but it all still seems a bit uncalled for.
Could you perhaps explain what do you mean by "relationship and interactivity with 22Cans"? All they do is copy/paste the articles from the steam announcements page and upvote your posts when you tell us to cool down. And occasionally they post a nice "fuck you" reply to someone and add a smiley face.
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Lord Ba'al
Supreme Deity
Posts: 6,260
Pledge level: Half a Partner
I like: Cats; single malt Scotch; Stargate; Amiga; fried potatoes; retro gaming; cheese; snickers; sticky tape.
I don't like: Dimples in the bottom of scotch bottles; Facebook games masquerading as godgames.
Steam: stonelesscutter
GOG: stonelesscutter
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Post by Lord Ba'al on Jul 26, 2015 13:43:57 GMT
Just as I say, this one is an example of the attitude shown everywhere. Wow, that's a really solid argument based on a lot of irrefutable facts. |
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Post by morsealworth on Jul 26, 2015 13:50:58 GMT
Well, when they say that they like you while tying you up to a bumper of a truck, it's not really wise to believe in their good intentions.
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Lord Ba'al
Supreme Deity
Posts: 6,260
Pledge level: Half a Partner
I like: Cats; single malt Scotch; Stargate; Amiga; fried potatoes; retro gaming; cheese; snickers; sticky tape.
I don't like: Dimples in the bottom of scotch bottles; Facebook games masquerading as godgames.
Steam: stonelesscutter
GOG: stonelesscutter
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Post by Lord Ba'al on Jul 26, 2015 13:54:22 GMT
Also petermolyneux didn't insult you. He quoted you on saying that the recent forum activity is hurting our/your relationship with 22cans and sad that that's a load of balls, since the current relationship is pretty much non existent and I agree with him on that. Than you said he could fuck off. Well nice.. I'm not defending his somewhat poor choice of words, but it all still seems a bit uncalled for. I have removed petermolyneux's ban. Not because of what you said but because of a discussion I had with another forum member in private. That member pointed out to me that if it had been any other member's post that had been responded on like that I would not have issued a ban. I guess that is true. It seems I overreacted and for that I apologize. The fact remains though that I do still feel insulted by the way petermolyneux worded his post and I would still like to see an apology for that. For all the time and energy I have spent on this place I think I at least deserve that much courtesy. |
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Lord Ba'al
Supreme Deity
Posts: 6,260
Pledge level: Half a Partner
I like: Cats; single malt Scotch; Stargate; Amiga; fried potatoes; retro gaming; cheese; snickers; sticky tape.
I don't like: Dimples in the bottom of scotch bottles; Facebook games masquerading as godgames.
Steam: stonelesscutter
GOG: stonelesscutter
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Post by Lord Ba'al on Jul 26, 2015 14:53:31 GMT
Could you perhaps explain what do you mean by "relationship and interactivity with 22Cans"? All they do is copy/paste the articles from the steam announcements page and upvote your posts when you tell us to cool down. And occasionally they post a nice "fuck you" reply to someone and add a smiley face. Indeed, I do see this happening and I agree that that is not always in good taste. Let me try to explain how I see our relationship (as a forum) with 22cans. If I even can. First of all I think I have to note that there's a distinction between how I feel as a forum member and how I feel as a forum host. As a forum member, I am a kickstarter backer who has followed project godus since the very beginning. At first I was highly excited about the project and I posted heavily (1000+ posts) on the original 22cans forum. After a while I began to notice that there was not a lot of interaction on that forum between the members and the developers, if there even was any at all. In that time there were regular video updates and at a certain point members of the community started raising concerns in regard to the content of those. It looked like the project was not going in the direction that we had hoped it would and as our concerns were dismissed we were becoming increasingly vocal about that. At a certain point the moderators of that forum started handling things quite badly and because on top of that the 22cans forum was closed off to the outside world the idea arose that there was a need for a new place. A place where anyone would be able to see exactly what was going on as opposed to the closed of forum where 22cans hid from the world how they were treating their backers. Hence, this forum was born. I recruited members from several places and slowly but surely the forum grew large enough to be noticed. The 22cans forum has long since been a wasteland, despite them making it publicly accessible later on and overhauling the forum. In any case, we kept outing our grievances with each and every aspect of godus here. Then George came along and started actually interacting with us. I think we became the forum that has seen to date the most interaction with any staff of 22cans, both PR and developers. Despite the grim state project godus was in, things were looking up for a change. Eventually it turned out that regardless of our interactions with 22cans the project was still going down the shitshute. ...dammit it's hard to keep the personal and admin separated... rambling on... Yadayadayada... cutting to the chase... Over the course of the whole project I have been increasingly disillusioned. I have given up hope that godus will turn into anything closely resembling what it was purposed to be a long long time ago. I've been through all the stages of grief. Because of having been through all of that I can now reflect on it and on the present situation in a way that allows me to look for the positive. I know that godus will never be what I want it to be and I have resigned to that fact. But godus can certainly become better than what it has been so far, there is no doubt about that. Therefore I am interested to see where 22cans are taking it. My personal relationship with 22cans is therefore as such that I look forward to any bit of information that they provide on the state of affairs. I no longer have reason to be angry with 22cans, I have moved past that. I do reserve the right to become angry again in the future of course if the situation calls for it, but for now I am good. I am not frustrated with them in any way shape or form. I personally enjoy the fact that staff members take the time to come here and talk. Although I must admit the talking doesn't seem to amount to much lately. The tide was high when Simon and Colin arrived here, but since then it has been ebbing more and more. In my position as forum founder and administrator I look at it like this. The mere presence of 22cans staff at this forum lends credibility and standing to the forum, regardless of what they say or do here. Their presence indicates that we are a force to be reckoned with. I like that. When non-members view the forum they can see the presence of the 22cans staff which could be a reason for them to join. I like that. When 22cans staff post updates about project godus in any way shape or form, I like that. The updates could always be better of course, but I still like them. They extend the forum as a source of information which is good. Several online journalists have become aware of our forum and used its content in their articles. I like that. I don't know if that would have ever happened if 22cans had never come around here in the first place. Of course there is no proving it one way or the other, but I like to think that it did make that difference. In short, as a forum admin, I like having them around. Besides these facts there is also the fact that some of the 22cans staff that came here have become highly respected and valued community members, like Monkeythumbz and Matthew Allen and Raspofabs. FuriousMoo was well liked too, but then he dropped off the face of the earth. As for colin22cans and simon22cans, I like them, but they haven't quite earned a position on the top shelf yet. Sorry Colin, I really like and appreciate the banner you made for us though.  A lot more would need to happen before they could reach the same level of exaltedness as the aforementioned ones. To sum it all up very succinctly and briefly. On a personal level I like having the 22cans peeps around. On an administrative level I like having the 22cans peeps around. EDIT: As an aside note, I also like the fact that jespergrip and Lucas Norr from Crytivo Games have joined and despite the fact that there hasn't as of yet been a lot of interaction with them I am hopeful for the future in that regard. Their presence and activity could prove to be very important for the future of this forum. How the forum community treats the members of the 22cans team could have a profound influence on whether or not the Crytivo peeps chose to engage with us or on the matter in which they will. |
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Aug 21, 2024 19:32:37 GMT
Aug 21, 2024 19:32:37 GMT
