The Emerald Prophet
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Post by The Emerald Prophet on Dec 5, 2015 18:04:32 GMT
The following is an array information relating to the Godus War Update. I can't say how I came across it (hence the anonymous post), but hopefully this'll give the community a few ideas for what to expect from the War Update. I'm not sure if any information has already mentioned, just trying to relay what I can.
First of all, the War update will be entirely separate from regular Godus gameplay. When you open Godus, you'll be given the option to choose between standard Godus and War Godus. Apparently, 22cans will focus on merging the two over time.
Upon opening Godus Wars, the menu is replaced with a planet which you can spin around with the mouse. There are 10 or so continents to choose from, and I'd estimate each one could hold around fifty to hundred maps each. On the globe is a "banner" representing your current position (clicking a continent moves your banner there), and once you've selected a continent- the continent will zoom in and divide itself into different equal portions, each portion representing a map. At time of writing, only about 8 maps existed (the other portions were there, but just for show). At a guess, I'd assume this is 22cans attempt to create the "planet sized" map they'd promised by creating hundreds of little maps that make up to one big one. Each portion is color coded by territory- territories you own will appear blue, territories controlled by other gods will be red (or whatever color that god represents).
Once you've selected an enemy controlled map, another menu will pop up. On the far left is your avatar, represented by a noble-looking Nordic fellow- and on the far right side is the enemy gods avatar, a sort of cross between father Christmas and Satan (apparently there will be other gods implemented, but he was the only other god atm). The two avatars are static images, but every so often a speech bubble will appear depicting one insult the other- and they both have names (which I can't recall, sorry x.x). The rest of the menu is devoted to selecting your (very hearthstoney looking) god cards, which you can pick on the left while your opponent does as well on the right of the screen.
Once you've chosen your god cards, the game will start. On one side of the map is your "Belief Silo" (literally just a huge glass tube filled with pink liquid), and on the other is your opponents Belief Silo. Each god starts with the same amount of followers (around 3, if I remember right), who will automatically start to build around the silo. The maps are reasonably bigger than the expedition ones, but they're clearly designed so that little sculpting is required- and there's no fog. Apparently, there are multiple victory conditions that will "secure" the map into your territory- including killing/converting all the other gods followers, destroying your opponents belief silo, etc. Purging the enemy can either be done by raising an army or using god powers, but the opponent god (controlled by a basic AI) can also do the same.
As expected, combat works as intended. By making several houses into a garrison, you can create ranks of soldiers who will act as a unit. You can get them to run up and down hills and attack enemy units. In skirmishes, each individual acts as an individual (ie: a soldier won't die unless he specifically is hit by a sword, etc- and they can't kill unless their arrow hits an enemy, etc). Apparently, the more battles a unit survives- the stronger they'll become.
Note that I only saw the assembler for Godus Wars (ie: a prototype to test assets to iron out any bugs), so anything I say could be subject to change. Anyway, thanks for reading! If someones got any questions, I'll answer as best I can.
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Lord Ba'al
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Post by Lord Ba'al on Dec 5, 2015 18:26:08 GMT
That is very interesting information. I wonder what we'll get to see once the update is out. Do you by any chance have any clue as to when that might be?
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Post by Praesme on Dec 5, 2015 20:42:06 GMT
First to the OP, Thanks? Do you have any proof you can share about any of this? No offense but unfounded claims surrounding 22cans are dime a dozen. You have a good narrative...
I cant tell if I want this to be true or not.
As suspected combat is a slapped on addition that doesn't fit godus.
What you describe sounds like populous, or the more recent reprisal universe.
If its true then 22cans is certainly doing a great job of early access. </sarcasm>
They seem to have taken the normal approach of just doing a thing. They are spending a bunch of time finalizing content for something they have only gotten feedback from internal testers on, and they are going to ignore all further feedback. I mean why would they start listening now?
But its been so long since anything official I can really only read this as dev trolling. There is nothing but unfounded "information" from an unknown source telling us its gonna be epic with a bunch of features... sounds like PM himself
Many promises have been made, implied, abandoned, then finally used to wipe 22cans ass.
And I already own reprisal universe....
There has been less movement by 22cons than usual, seeming like the holiday silence started early and we will probably have to wait till Easter for them let combat loose in response to news media trying to take them out back and put them down.
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The Emerald Prophet
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Post by The Emerald Prophet on Dec 5, 2015 21:20:22 GMT
No idea, though I'd assume that the assembler was a good sign that most of the key features were finished. However, the assembler I saw was made on unity, not the engine they use for Godus- which means they still need to put all the pieces together. Besides that- there are still maps to do, bugs to be squashed, balancing issues, etc.
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The Emerald Prophet
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Post by The Emerald Prophet on Dec 5, 2015 21:36:57 GMT
First to the OP, Thanks? Do you have any proof you can share about any of this? No offense but unfounded claims surrounding 22cans are dime a dozen. You have a good narrative... I cant tell if I want this to be true or not. As suspected combat is a slapped on addition that doesn't fit godus. What you describe sounds like populous, or the more recent reprisal universe. If its true then 22cans is certainly doing a great job of early access. </sarcasm> They seem to have taken the normal approach of just doing a thing. They are spending a bunch of time finalizing content for something they have only gotten feedback from internal testers on, and they are going to ignore all further feedback. I mean why would they start listening now? But its been so long since anything official I can really only read this as dev trolling. There is nothing but unfounded "information" from an unknown source telling us its gonna be epic with a bunch of features... sounds like PM himself Many promises have been made, implied, abandoned, then finally used to wipe 22cans ass. And I already own reprisal universe.... There has been less movement by 22cons than usual, seeming like the holiday silence started early and we will probably have to wait till Easter for them let combat loose in response to news media trying to take them out back and put them down. Sorry, if I had proof I would have given it. Personally, I agree- what I saw was a lot of features that didn't fit with godus, I figured it'd be better to stick with the facts for the OP though. From what I saw, the war update felt very similar to voyages (as in you're stuck on a map with a fixed objective. The only incentive is to finish the objective as quickly as possible, and no matter what your actions the outcome is still the same). I'm not a dev, but it'd probably be better for me if people believed I was. Hopefully, after the war update they'll start working on making Godus more of a "God" game. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 5, 2015 22:38:31 GMT
Not too surprised about the god cards if what Emerald says is true. The initial card teaser 22Cans released looked like nothing more than a lazy lift from Blizzard's Hearthstone card design.
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Post by hardly on Dec 6, 2015 0:23:05 GMT
Sounds a lot like an RTS. Map with regions, battles, emphasis on commanding troops, base building.
I guess whether it is good or not depends entirely on the implementation. The challenge with going down the RTS path is the combat has to be very good as that will be the focus. If the opponent (are we talking single player or AI?) is not good then it wont be any fun.
You can see how they will tick off a few promises with this including the God of Gods. It could be their redemption in terms of pushing out something that isn't a complete pile of poo.
In terms of Unity why not just rerelease GODUS in Unity if that is what they've developed it in? Surely that is a better option than Marmalade or whatever it is they used before.
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Post by Crumpy Six on Dec 6, 2015 0:27:23 GMT
Sounds like you've been involved in a user focus group, maybe? Whatever the case, thanks for sharing. I have no idea why 22Cans couldn't just share this themselves. After all, they have repeatedly told us how valuable and important our feedback is! They could also have included it in the opt-in branch, except of course that they have abandoned that, along with every other commitment made to the existing player base.
It sounds like the combat features of Godus have been seriously curtailed by technical limitations. Once again, instead of integrating a concept properly, they have proposed another game mode, which is bolted on much like voyages and takes us even further away from the initial ambition and vision for the game. At this point I don't suppose it comes as any surprise, since Godus has long been past the point of no return where that is concerned.
I believe the development objective for Godus is no longer to even attempt to meet the expectations of the backers/Early Access customers. Instead, they are going to try to crowbar Godus into some kind of completed, playable state where it can be passed off as a medicore RTS. Good enough to get access to the wider market (that is, RTS fans who would not normally be all that interested in a 'god' game) and make a few more sales.
The idea of the world having ~10 continents and 50-100 maps on each strikes me as odd. Assuming 22Cans is responsible for creating all of these maps themselves, they have made a lot of work for themselves. Maybe they've had some success with procedurally generated maps? Or maybe they're going to rely on user-developed content.
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Post by hardly on Dec 6, 2015 0:36:39 GMT
The idea of the world having ~10 continents and 50-100 maps on each strikes me as odd. Assuming 22Cans is responsible for creating all of these maps themselves, they have made a lot of work for themselves. Maybe they've had some success with procedurally generated maps? Or maybe they're going to rely on user-developed content. If they can get that to work in multiplayer in the style of something like Planetside 2 then they can tick off Jupiter on a technicality and the God of Gods if he has any control.
Part of me would be impressed if they managed to release something of this size that actually worked but part of me, like you Crumpy, feels jaded about the "bolt-on" tactics that always seem to target meeting promises to the barest letter of the promise.
Lets see what gets released anyway. If its good then we will applaud them, if it sucks we will let them know that too. Personally, I don't see them having the networking chops to make a multiplayer RTS work in a shared world but lets see.
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Post by Spiderweb on Dec 6, 2015 6:18:41 GMT
Sounds like you've been involved in a user focus group, maybe? Whatever the case, thanks for sharing. I have no idea why 22Cans couldn't just share this themselves. After all, they have repeatedly told us how valuable and important our feedback is! They could also have included it in the opt-in branch, except of course that they have abandoned that, along with every other commitment made to the existing player base. It sounds like the combat features of Godus have been seriously curtailed by technical limitations. Once again, instead of integrating a concept properly, they have proposed another game mode, which is bolted on much like voyages and takes us even further away from the initial ambition and vision for the game. At this point I don't suppose it comes as any surprise, since Godus has long been past the point of no return where that is concerned. I believe the development objective for Godus is no longer to even attempt to meet the expectations of the backers/Early Access customers. Instead, they are going to try to crowbar Godus into some kind of completed, playable state where it can be passed off as a medicore RTS. Good enough to get access to the wider market (that is, RTS fans who would not normally be all that interested in a 'god' game) and make a few more sales. The idea of the world having ~10 continents and 50-100 maps on each strikes me as odd. Assuming 22Cans is responsible for creating all of these maps themselves, they have made a lot of work for themselves. Maybe they've had some success with procedurally generated maps? Or maybe they're going to rely on user-developed content. To be fair a seperate game mode is the only way they could go, without losing the "zen" like homeworld. They dug themselves a hole with to many Kickstarter promises. It does sound interesting (if proven true) and like they are trying to cram a lot into the combat release, but instead of drumming up interest with more info, any feedback we gave (on the card design for example) is always taken the wrong way then ignored. Godus does not have good PR and a wall of silence, only jades people's opinion of the whole company more and more. |
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Post by hardly on Dec 6, 2015 8:09:54 GMT
Sounds like you've been involved in a user focus group, maybe? Whatever the case, thanks for sharing. I have no idea why 22Cans couldn't just share this themselves. After all, they have repeatedly told us how valuable and important our feedback is! They could also have included it in the opt-in branch, except of course that they have abandoned that, along with every other commitment made to the existing player base. It sounds like the combat features of Godus have been seriously curtailed by technical limitations. Once again, instead of integrating a concept properly, they have proposed another game mode, which is bolted on much like voyages and takes us even further away from the initial ambition and vision for the game. At this point I don't suppose it comes as any surprise, since Godus has long been past the point of no return where that is concerned. I believe the development objective for Godus is no longer to even attempt to meet the expectations of the backers/Early Access customers. Instead, they are going to try to crowbar Godus into some kind of completed, playable state where it can be passed off as a medicore RTS. Good enough to get access to the wider market (that is, RTS fans who would not normally be all that interested in a 'god' game) and make a few more sales. The idea of the world having ~10 continents and 50-100 maps on each strikes me as odd. Assuming 22Cans is responsible for creating all of these maps themselves, they have made a lot of work for themselves. Maybe they've had some success with procedurally generated maps? Or maybe they're going to rely on user-developed content. To be fair a seperate game mode is the only way they could go, without losing the "zen" like homeworld. They dug themselves a hole with to many Kickstarter promises. It does sound interesting (if proven true) and like they are trying to cram a lot into the combat release, but instead of drumming up interest with more info, any feedback we gave (on the card design for example) is always taken the wrong way then ignored. Godus does not have good PR and a wall of silence, only jades people's opinion of the whole company more and more. If it's as ambitious as he says why not talk about the details? I find the point about unity really interesting. Is there any reason why they couldn't just rerelease the game under unity? Would the reason be mobile compatibility perhaps? |
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Post by militairensneuvelen on Dec 6, 2015 9:11:48 GMT
I am outraged! (no I'm not...)
It will be boring as.... with just archers and swordmen.
A combat mode with 2 different types of units.
So not even rock, paper, scissors....
All this waiting and anticipation (no, that ship left in 2014 (the anticipation ship that is...).
-Catastrophic failure
Failure a scale so vast as to encompass the lives and livelihoods of generations to come. Examples: the meltdowns at Fukushima Dai-1 and Chernobyl; building codes in Haiti before January 2010. Possible future catastrophic fails: asteroids, climate change.
-Abject failure
This failure marks you and you may not ever fully recover from it. People lose their lives, jobs, respect, or livelihoods. Examples: British Petroleum's Gulf oil spill; mortgage-backed securities.
-Start-up failure
A big bet backed by money and momentum, that wipes out both when the market shifts or the business model hits reality. Examples: Pets.com; Jumo.org; Solyndra LLC
-Structural failure
It cuts - deeply - but it doesn't permanently cripple your identity or enterprise. Examples: Apple iPhone 4's antenna; Windows Vista.
-Glorious failure
Going out in a botched but beautiful blaze of glory - catastrophic but exhilarating. Example: Jamaican bobsled team.
-Epic failure
This is a failure that brings joy to all and perhaps even fame and stardom for the fail succeeder. Examples: Celebrity antics; Youtube videos of people falling down; FAILblog
Common failure
Everyday instances of screwing up that are not too difficult to recover from. The apology was invented for this category. Examples: oversleeping and missing a meeting at work; forgetting to pick up your kids from school; overcooking the tuna.
-Version failure
Small failures that lead to incremental but meaningful improvements over time. Examples: Linux operating system; evolution.
-Predicted failure
Failure as an essential part of a process that allows you to see what it is you really need to do more clearly because of the shortcomings. Example: the prototype -- only by creating imperfect early versions of it can you learn what's necessary to refine it.
-Opportunity Failure
The failure to take risks that leaves you wanting and is usually associated with sentences that begin with, "I should have..." Examples: Not buying Apple stock in 2006; Not selling Nokia stock in 2010; Not getting off your butt today.
Where is my popcorn...
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Post by Mandrake on Dec 6, 2015 9:26:47 GMT
If it's as ambitious as he says why not talk about the details? I find the point about unity really interesting. Is there any reason why they couldn't just rerelease the game under unity? Would the reason be mobile compatibility perhaps? The thing about Unity is that it uses Marmalade for bog paper in terms of cross-platform compatibility. This is something the Technical Director would have known about - Jamie Stowe at one point, but them it was put into the hands of Tim Rance, but apparently Stowe is still on the payroll for "reasons" just like any "producer" for Godus. But this would have invalidated one of 22cans' Kickstarter rewards, no? So that means, again, that Marmalard was a publisher choice, which rather neatly invalidates 22cons' entire "indie" farce - but that is yet one of many other topics... PS: To any of 22cans who actually give a shit about this community anymore, please be advised that the hamster powering your website is a little lethargic upon its wheel today. |
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Post by Mandrake on Dec 6, 2015 9:31:11 GMT
I am outraged! (no I'm not...) It will be boring as.... with just archers and swordmen. A combat mode with 2 different types of units. So not even rock, paper, scissors.... At that point you might as well load up a game of Sacred and have a much more enjoyable time of a "god game". Really, if they haven't even given cursory attention towards the unit balance, and added a third and fourth type of unit, then I really wonder what they are doing with this farce. Oh, that's right - nothing! |
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Post by Crumpy Six on Dec 6, 2015 10:42:55 GMT
The idea of the world having ~10 continents and 50-100 maps on each strikes me as odd. Assuming 22Cans is responsible for creating all of these maps themselves, they have made a lot of work for themselves. Maybe they've had some success with procedurally generated maps? Or maybe they're going to rely on user-developed content. If they can get that to work in multiplayer in the style of something like Planetside 2 then they can tick off Jupiter on a technicality and the God of Gods if he has any control.
Part of me would be impressed if they managed to release something of this size that actually worked but part of me, like you Crumpy, feels jaded about the "bolt-on" tactics that always seem to target meeting promises to the barest letter of the promise.
Lets see what gets released anyway. If its good then we will applaud them, if it sucks we will let them know that too. Personally, I don't see them having the networking chops to make a multiplayer RTS work in a shared world but lets see.
Assuming Emerald Prophet's post is true (and it seems perfectly plausible to me) I think we can take some positives from it: - It means Godus is still being developed. We were getting to the point of imagining the project had been abandoned, so this is good news. - It sounds like a substantial content update. The dev updates we've had since Simon and Colin joined 22Cans have given the impression that novice programmers have spent the last 9 months struggling with basic search algorithms, so it's encouraging to hear that they have actually managed to achieve something. - While it will be infuriating if this combat piece is presented as fulfilment of Kickstarter promises, it may actually be a step towards making Godus a fun and entertaining game. In my opinion the present implementation of Godus has been almost unplayable since the introduction of the Wheat mechanic. Emerald Prophet, from what you saw, did Gems, Wheat or Ore play any role in the combat scenarios? Also, ignoring any prejudice based on what Godus should have been, did it look like it would be fun to play? |
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Post by More than ten on Dec 6, 2015 14:08:50 GMT
Emerald - Have you actually seen this first hand? Mobile? Pc? Mac?
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Post by Snip on Dec 6, 2015 19:01:18 GMT
<snip> Upon opening Godus Wars, the menu is replaced with a planet which you can spin around with the mouse. <snip> |
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Post by Emerald Prophet on Dec 6, 2015 19:46:21 GMT
If they can get that to work in multiplayer in the style of something like Planetside 2 then they can tick off Jupiter on a technicality and the God of Gods if he has any control.
Part of me would be impressed if they managed to release something of this size that actually worked but part of me, like you Crumpy, feels jaded about the "bolt-on" tactics that always seem to target meeting promises to the barest letter of the promise.
Lets see what gets released anyway. If its good then we will applaud them, if it sucks we will let them know that too. Personally, I don't see them having the networking chops to make a multiplayer RTS work in a shared world but lets see.
Assuming Emerald Prophet's post is true (and it seems perfectly plausible to me) I think we can take some positives from it: - It means Godus is still being developed. We were getting to the point of imagining the project had been abandoned, so this is good news. - It sounds like a substantial content update. The dev updates we've had since Simon and Colin joined 22Cans have given the impression that novice programmers have spent the last 9 months struggling with basic search algorithms, so it's encouraging to hear that they have actually managed to achieve something. - While it will be infuriating if this combat piece is presented as fulfilment of Kickstarter promises, it may actually be a step towards making Godus a fun and entertaining game. In my opinion the present implementation of Godus has been almost unplayable since the introduction of the Wheat mechanic. Emerald Prophet, from what you saw, did Gems, Wheat or Ore play any role in the combat scenarios? Also, ignoring any prejudice based on what Godus should have been, did it look like it would be fun to play? In terms of Gems/Wheat/Ore, there were no farms or mines in what I saw- although I wouldn't be surprised if that were to change as balancing issues are covered later in development. The war update definitely has the potential to be good/playable, but there were differences that the community weren't anticipating- hence why I made this thread when I saw the update myself. To put it simply, the war update is a different approach to Godus compared to the one we know- a result of new people joining the team, I imagine. I can tell you the features worked, but I couldn't say whether it was fun or not based on that stage of development- although obviously different ideas will appeal to different people. If 22cans repeats the design it used for Voyages (ie: map after map challenges, progressing linearly) the update will flop (imo). If the update revolved around sustaining an empire (ie: expanding your boarders, producing and distributing resources to territory's with varying needs, against one or more opposing empires) I would play it. I expect the actual update will fall inbetween those two specifications, although I couldn't say which it would favor based on what I saw. |
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The Emerald Prophet
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Post by The Emerald Prophet on Dec 6, 2015 19:50:15 GMT
Emerald - Have you actually seen this first hand? Mobile? Pc? Mac? I saw what I did first hand (although, admittedly- I was only looking over the shoulder of the one who was playing), and it was on PC. |
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Post by More than ten on Dec 6, 2015 21:03:19 GMT
Emerald - Have you actually seen this first hand? Mobile? Pc? Mac? I saw what I did first hand (although, admittedly- I was only looking over the shoulder of the one who was playing), and it was on PC. Cool (sorry I missed the comment about the mouse earlier). Some expert cafe stalking by the sounds of it Hopefully we can get to see it soon |
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